Poachers! It's that time again.

[DarkShadow]

Caps,

I agree with you 100%.

You make several valid points. DFG stopped being a champion for anglers years ago and became an enforcement agency, and a friend for individuals who put water rights in front of fishery management. (Let's keep growing almonds in California when it costs more to grow them than what they actually sell them for) They think by stocking a few ponds here and there with triploids (don't wanna hurt the native yellow tree frog of Azusa) and catfish during the summer at our local cement ponds, they will keep the masses happy; their own, "let them eat cake" scenario.

I've always been privy of knowing that most of their conservation efforts were backed by private entities, either CalTrout or Trout Unlimited, or individuals who would volunteer their efforts for free.

California anglers should know that the DFW now are just akin to the cashier at the front of the Walmart registers. If there's a spill on Aisle 3? Someone else will take care of it. If there's a group of shoplifters stealing Enfamil and Trojan rubbers behind the glass? Someone else's problem. As long as we get our license revenue.

And when it comes to restoration or enhancements to the fishery, they seem to focus their efforts on causes that will get good publicity, regardless of how many licensed anglers it benefits.

Of course, I wish there was a public forum, just like FNN, where discourse could happen between the employees at DFG and your regular anglers. We can find out where our money is going, and what type of rehabilitation is being done in our state fisheries. Hell, I know a few welders that would donate a few hours of their time to fix the grates at the major lakes that have influxes of striped bass coming down from the state project that are affecting our local fisheries, but that ship has left the harbor years ago and there's no going back from that. But DFG knows that the water management agencies tell THEM what to do, since there's no money in the fishing, but money in the actual water, so recreation (read: fishermen) take a back seat.

I see the Cap said that they are stepping up enforcement, because ticket writing brings in revenue. But when you call their offices to report offenses, and they don't pick up their phones nor dispatch wardens to these lakes where these offenses are occurring, you can't expect our fisheries to improve. Especially when citation fines are going back to the 'general fund' which is another discussion in the making?

And of course, when those 'offenses' go against the opposite of what they preach (in regards to chumming for baby striped bass), you ask if they even keep up to date with their data.

DFW thinks that destroying a natural fish's habitat can be restored by stocking. That there is the problem, and we will never find a solution at this point. We keep paying our 70 dollars every year. And that's all they care about. Making sure they get that money from anglers every year.

And I hate to put DFW employees on the spot, but Kwin...where are you? Is there a medium that we can use to reach out to the DFW to address these grievances and questions, other than "go check the website?" I know that you're on the biology side, but if you have first hand data that there are some bodies of water in Southern California where the predation of the striped bass had gotten so out of control that it affected legendary fisheries, did you raise your hand and perhaps asked if these local slot limits could be changed? I completely understand being such at the lower level of the rung that nothing you say gets taken into consideration, put perhaps with the help of licensed anglers, there could be some headway to help our fisheries.

[contium]

Why are there even limits on stripers in Skinner? They are there unintentionally and have destroyed the lake. They are over populated and are stunted. She be a law that you have to kill everyone you catch.

[NFCD I]

(I saw a great trick at the lake yesterday. After a guy and his wife, I'm guessing she's his wife, finished poaching well over 50 stripers by chumming. He dropped her off at the # 2 ramp with an ice chest. He then took his boat around to the #1 ramp and put it on his trailer. He then drove over to pick her up at the #2 ramp.
Why do you suppose they went through the trouble of dropping her off first?

[DarkShadow]

Why are there even limits on stripers in Skinner? They are there unintentionally and have destroyed the lake. They are over populated and are stunted. She be a law that you have to kill everyone you catch.

Why do you suppose they went through the trouble of dropping her off first?

Oooh, oooh, i know this one!



Because there's a non sensical law prohibiting the removal of more than 10 stunted apex predators that have destroyed and continue to destroy our fisheries, and they didn't want to get a ticket by breaking a law that should be amended anyhow?

[NFCD I]

I guess I'm missing the point. I enjoy fishing. I fish for Stripers, LMB, Bluegill, and crappie occasionally. I, and my family, enjoy eating Stripers. Hell, we eat about any type of fish other than Carp and LMB. Explain to me one more time how Stripers are ruining the fishery. I caught and had a mount made of a 10.5# LMB I caught at Perris back in 2010. Perris also has Stripers.
I'm all for a larger limit on Stripers. I also agree there should be a slot limit on them.
I'm against people coming to the lake and not following the RULES and LAWS.

[Askwhy]

I guess I'm missing the point. I enjoy fishing. I fish for Stripers, LMB, Bluegill, and crappie occasionally. I, and my family, enjoy eating Stripers. Hell, we eat about any type of fish other than Carp and LMB. Explain to me one more time how Stripers are ruining the fishery. I caught and had a mount made of a 10.5# LMB I caught at Perris back in 2010. Perris also has Stripers.
I'm all for a larger limit on Stripers. I also agree there should be a slot limit on them.
I'm against people coming to the lake and not following the RULES and LAWS.

NCFD I agree with you 100% I think the thread got lost from it’s original intention.
Here’s the bottom line though the fish and game wardens usually walk the shores or confront you as your leaving the lake which really only gets those that either have no current license or no license at all , it also sometimes catch’s those that like to fish with a abundance of poles .
Years back I was fishing the San Diego bay and we got boarded by the fish and game as they were actually on the water enforcing the rules making sure you had proper life vests , legal size fish and current license etc .
I’m thinking in all the years I’ve fished this lake not once can I remember seeing them on the lake , that might be the answer to keeping the fishery alive for those of us who enjoy catching fish .

[DarkShadow]

Explain to me one more time how Stripers are ruining the fishery.

Research is at your fingertips, NFCD. Why explain when you yourself can do the research?

Here's a start down the rabbit hole: http://www.fishingnetwork.net/forum4...0323-Sat-10-26

That's the same thread where I pulled up the quote I posted above, which comes from our esteemed member "Kwin," who is a Department of Fish and Wildlife biologist from the Southern District, who advocates the removal of as many juvenile stripers that anglers can catch. I believe the saying is, this information is "from the horse's mouth."

You can also peruse through anecdotal evidence, which shows that the fisheries in which the striped bass has gotten a foot hold (Castaic, Pyramid, Silverwood, i.e, reservoirs connected to the state water project (coincidence?), have taken a shot.

I'm against people coming to the lake and not following the RULES and LAWS.

With that mentality, you'd be the guy "who feels women should be allowed to vote in 1919," but would chastise them for breaking the law if they tried to vote. So you know the law is inconsistent with reality, but still chastise others that break it.

Would you send a 'pothead' to San Quentin for life smoking a doob, but then turn around and say "it's ok to smoke marijuana?" If you're "all for a larger limit on Stripers" and "agree there should be a slot limit on them," why do you agree with the law on the books if they don't reflect with what what you just said you 'are all for?'

The great thing about this country, from the federal government to state and local agencies, is that archaic laws have the ability to be changed, and constantly do. Unfortunately, the DFW today doesn't have the resources to review the majority of their slot limit regulations because they're unique for every geographical area, and my opinion is that perhaps it's time that these laws are reviewed and changed for the betterment of the fishery, which would enhance the angling experience, regardless if you soak bait for stripers, or are fishing tournaments for largemouth bass.

How can we change these rules when people are gung ho about keeping the status quo?

When a DFG biologist is advocating the removal of as many juveline stripers as you can to assist a fishery, I'm going to side with the side of science, and will advocate the change of these laws that are obviously not written to assist to revival of many of our fisheries.

Now, you're not getting let off the hook so easily. After you read the post that I referred to earlier, and whose URL I just posted right now, I'd like to know your opinion again. Remember. That's a DFG biologist that has posted their expert opinion on this matter. Hopefully after reading that thread, you'll be on the path on getting your answer on "how the Stripers are ruining our fishery."

Tight lines!

[kwin]

The F&G Commission denied our attempt to raise the limit on Striped Bass over 20 years ago. Added recent push back from anglers in NorCal who do not want the limit increased from 2@ 18" on the Delta to a 10 with no size limit would not help the cause to increase the limit here either. As a matter of fact, most all anglers cannot and do not catch limits of 10 on a regular basis to give weight for any push toward increasing the limit here again.

Over limits and chumming are unlawful and it is an anglers personal responsibility to abide by the laws set forth, and enforcements job to enforce the regulations if they are not. That said, given all of the variables in play, I believe 10 with no size restriction is an adequate management tool if they are abided.

Our Lk Skinner angler surveys show that, in 2020, there were 2,321 striped bass reported caught and only 1,406 were kept (61%). While I realize there were likely a minority of anglers fudging their "kept" numbers in the survey, the large sample size and bottom line estimate of slightly over half was kept does not indicate overfishing or over harvest by any stretch. I would say the percentage should be higher......especially if larger specimens are desired. Catch and release of highly fecund species like striped bass in inland waters creates stunted populations.

[NFCD I]

Thanks for your input Kwin.

Can a given lake have different regulations than others?

[DarkShadow]

The F&G Commission denied our attempt to raise the limit on Striped Bass over 20 years ago.

How does the process work for revamping legislation? What was the exact reason for the denial? Does the F&G Commission review legislation on a yearly basis? Who recommends the changes? I have this weird feeling that the individuals involved with the changes in legislation are not following scientific data, but are pressured by other sources.

Added recent push back from anglers in NorCal who do not want the limit increased from 2@ 18" on the Delta to a 10 with no size limit would not help the cause to increase the limit here either.

Understandable, but IMO, we're talking apples and oranges. Will you not agree that the Delta is a completely different ecosystem than our landlocked reservoirs? (Probably why the average size of the stripers I've caught in the Delta are a wee *tad* larger than the runts down here?) And, shouldn't each ecosystem be analyzed separately?

As a matter of fact, most all anglers cannot and do not catch limits of 10 on a regular basis to give weight for any push toward increasing the limit here again.

According to this post, there are 'poachers' who are catching 50 fish! Get those guys on the payroll.

Over limits and chumming are unlawful and it is an anglers personal responsibility to abide by the laws set forth, and enforcements job to enforce the regulations if they are not. That said, given all of the variables in play, I believe 10 with no size restriction is an adequate management tool if they are abided.

But if most all anglers are not catching limits of 10, why not raise the limit to 25? That way, the individuals who have dialed down the bite can benefit from the raised limit, which will essentially help the lake in the long run?

Our Lk Skinner angler surveys show that, in 2020, there were 2,321 striped bass reported caught and only 1,406 were kept (61%). While I realize there were likely a minority of anglers fudging their "kept" numbers in the survey, the large sample size and bottom line estimate of slightly over half was kept does not indicate overfishing or over harvest by any stretch. I would say the percentage should be higher......especially if larger specimens are desired. Catch and release of highly fecund species like striped bass in inland waters creates stunted populations.

Thank you for information and I bolded the last sentence for emphasis. Essentially, keep throwing those juvenile stripers back, and keep expecting to catch them over and over. Remember the days of double digit stripers being constantly caught at Skinner? I do.

Having said that, what is your personal opinion on the relationship with a highly stunted population of striped bass in our waters, and how it affects other species? How does it affect forage? How does it affect the fishery in general, as we know that it affects it's own species by creating a stunted population.