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Thread: Legalization

  1. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediMindTricks View Post
    chasing girls is a much funner thing to do, at 15.
    trust me.
    yup,,,,

  2. #232

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    Quote Originally Posted by makersmark View Post
    Sansou, find links to the three major International drug control treaties currently in force as well as additional information, and remember you asked for these, so please do not turn around and ask me to read them for you, if you do not wish to read them then perhaps it may be a good idea to refrain from requesting such links.

    International Treaty - 1961 Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_...Narcotic_Drugs

    International Treaty - 1971 Convention on Psychotropic Substances
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convent...pic_Substances

    International Treaty - 1988 United Nations Convention Against Illicit Traffic in Narcotic Drugs and Psychotropic Substances.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_...pic_Substances

    Here is a link to a video that may be interesting to some
    http://www.videosift.com/video/Ameri...e-Full-Movie-1

    Here is some additional information regarding international drug policy history and info on other countries that feel America forces or bullies them into compliance of their drug policies.

    “The international war on drugs is a policy conceived, created and enforced by the government of the United States of America. Eight hundred philosophers, scientists and statesmen say it's time to stop the madness.”

    “On June 6, 1998, a surprising letter was delivered to Kofi Annan, secretary-general of the United Nations. We believe, the letter declared, that the global war on drugs is now causing more harm than drug abuse itself. The letter was signed by 800 statesmen, politicians, academics and other public figures. Former UN secretary-general Javier Perez de Cuellar signed. So did George Shultz, the former American secretary of state, and Joycelyn Elders, the former American surgeon-general. Nobel laureates such as Milton Friedman and Argentina's Adolfo Perez Esquivel added their names. Four former presidents and seven former cabinet ministers from Latin American countries signed. And several eminent Canadians were among the signatories.

    The drug policies the world has been following for decades are a destructive failure, they said. Trying to stamp out drug abuse by banning drugs has only created an illegal industry worth $400 billion US or roughly eight per cent of international trade. The letter continued: This industry has empowered organized criminals, corrupted governments at all levels, eroded internal security, stimulated violence, and distorted both economic markets and moral values. And it concluded that these were the consequences not of drug use per se, but of decades of failed and futile drug war policies.

    This powerful statement landed on Annan's desk just as the United Nations was holding a special assembly on global drug problems. Going into that meeting, the governments of the world appeared all but unanimous in the belief that the best way to combat drug abuse was to ban the production, sale or possession of certain drugs. Drug prohibition, most governments feel, makes harmful substances less available to people and far more expensive than they would otherwise be. Combined with the threat of punishment for using or selling drugs, prohibition significantly cuts the number of people using these substances, thus saving them from the torment of addiction and reducing the personal and social harms drugs can inflict. For these governments—and probably for most people in most countries—drug prohibition is just common sense.

    Still, the letter to Annan showed that this view is far from unanimous. In fact, a large and growing number of world leaders and experts think the war on drugs is nothing less than a humanitarian disaster. Still, governments are nearly unanimous in supporting drug prohibition. There is little debate at the official level. It's not easy to imagine alternatives to a policy that has been in place for decades, especially when few people remember how the policy came into being in the first place, or why. War on drugs is a compelling sound bite, whereas the damage drug prohibition may do is complex and impossible to summarize on a bumper sticker.

    But the core reason the war on drugs completely dominates the official policies of so many nations, including our own, is simple: The United States insists on it. The international war on drugs is a policy conceived, created and enforced by the government of the United States of America. Originally, nations were cajoled, prodded or bullied into joining it. Then it became international orthodoxy, and today most national governments, including Canada's, are enthusiastic supporters of prohibition. To the extent that they debate drug policy at all, it is only to question how strictly or harshly prohibition should be enforced, not whether the basic idea is sound. The few officials and governments that do stray, even slightly, outside the prohibition orthodoxy are cajoled, manipulated or bullied to get back in.”

    Continued in the following link for those interested.
    http://hartford-hwp.com/archives/27c/588.html
    Ok 800 statesmen, scientists etc. signed a letter to the U.N.. Let's see there's about 6 million scientists in the U.S.. Statesmen, probably about 25000 or more in the U.S.. Are you getting the point here? 800 is a drop in the bucket and means squat!
    I can go on the internet and circulate a petition and get twice that number in a week, if it's a meaningful cause!
    If a million scientists were supporting legalization I might take note and rethink my ideas, but 800, I don't think that's going to do it!. And who are the presidents? I don't remember more than 5 being alive at the same time, and one of them was Reagan and he had Alzheimers so that leaves him out. Carter, Clinton, Bush1 and Bush2? I don't think Bush 2 would have signed such a deal! Hmmmmm? Just curious on that, not questioning it, I'd just like to know.
    Last edited by txcurry; 05-21-2009 at 04:44 PM.

  3. #233

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    Quote Originally Posted by makersmark View Post
    LEAP (Law Enforcement Against Prohibition)
    http://leap.cc/cms/index.php


    in case some of you dont know this, there is a large group of Law Enforcement personnel that are trying to end prohibition because they have seen first hand the amount of damage it creates, this should say something as they are the very people who enforced these laws.

    LEAP's Mission Statement


    Founded on March 16, 2002, LEAP is made up of current and former members of law enforcement who believe the existing drug policies have failed in their intended goals of addressing the problems of crime, drug abuse, addiction, juvenile drug use, stopping the flow of illegal drugs into this country and the internal sale and use of illegal drugs. By fighting a war on drugs the government has increased the problems of society and made them far worse. A system of regulation rather than prohibition is a less harmful, more ethical and a more effective public policy.

    The mission of LEAP is to reduce the multitude of unintended harmful consequences resulting from fighting the war on drugs and to lessen the incidence of death, disease, crime, and addiction by ultimately ending drug prohibition.

    LEAP's goals are:

    1. To educate the public, the media, and policy makers, to the failure of current drug policy by presenting a true picture of the history, causes and effects of drug abuse and the crimes related to drug prohibition and
    2. To restore the public's respect for law enforcement, which has been greatly diminished by its involvement in imposing drug prohibition.

    LEAP's main strategy for accomplishing these goals is to create a constantly enlarging speakers bureau staffed with knowledgeable and articulate former drug-warriors who describe the impact of current drug policies on: police/community relations; the safety of law enforcement officers and suspects; police corruption and misconduct; and the financial and human costs associated with current drug policies.
    LEAP on their website shows a membership of 1845, probably about 1/2 to 2/3 are actual law enforcement so say 2/3 about 1200. That's less than half the total of officers on the Dallas Police Rolls not to mention LAPD, maybe a third of theirs. Hardly imposing numbers supporting legalization.

    Anyone can make a website and you will find varying opinions in every walk of life. Police and Law enforcement number in the millions, it's not hard to find a couple thousand out of a few million that support legalization. I bet you'll find at least half of that that support NAMBLA among law enforcement!

  4. #234
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    No NORML membership nessary!

    Aspirin is directly the cause of hundreds of deaths in the US each year, but you are told its safe, and even the AMA recommends a pill a day to prevent blood clots. Bayer patented aspirin back in the late 1800's an pretty much wiped all other forms of competition because they were the first to come out with a convenient, pill-form pain reliever. While you can only patent things for so long in the US, Bayer still holds patents in many countries in the world. Who cares about pot? Who cares about aspirin? Nobody, unless you point out the extremes.

    All sides, regardless of view, use the same tactics and methods to argue their case. This is just one of those things that people will never agree on regardless of legality while slinging the same stones.

    Is it healthy or unhealthy? Nobody really cares, it always becomes a morals issue.

    If you argue that smoking is bad for you, but are told that you don't have to smoke it, it doesn't change how you feel. You still argue that smoking is bad, yet nobody is arguing with you to "smoke"

    If you argue that it will only be abused, others will argue anything can be abused.

    If you argue it is an addictive substance, others will argue it is no more addictive than other substances that are currently legalized. That wont make you want to save the world against other potentially harmful substances. I think most people can agree that pot isnt in the same league as coke, heroin, or meth but regardless it still has its dangers.

    I think things are fine where they are in CA. MJ is decriminalized, but still illegal. Those who are really using MJ medicinally have the access they need. Those who are using it recreationally aren't directly funding the street criminals. If you are deathly against pot, you don't have to worry about your doctor ever suggesting it to you. They follow federal laws, and ignore state laws. If you are not against it, you can at least find a doctor who will discuss it even if it is just to ask questions. The MJ doctor will still advise you to look into other alternatives.

    If you argue its for the good of mankind to ban pot, I have to disagree with you. However, I'm willing to exchange it for the prohibition of alcohol and coffee. Lets clean up CA's streets by removing all the drunk drivers, coffee in lap drivers, and stoned drivers. I would be all for that. Imagine how much progress we can make without those distractions.

    No matter what is provided as evidence, it will never be enough because as mentioned before, people want a black and white answer.

    "Is marijuana good or bad?"

    Come on, we all know it will never be that easy. Should it be legalized? I say yes, for adults (ie: those who can legally be held accountable for their actions). Everyone can stay focused on who shouldn't have legal access, but isn't that the case for anything? (ie: I don't want angry people to have access to fertilizer and a moving truck) What happened to everything in moderation? The irresponsible people with addictive personalities jacked it up.

    I would not give pot to my kids. I would not give it to your kids. I would not give my kids alcohol. I would not give my kids cigarettes. I would not give my kids Dr prescribed drugs that weren't intended for them. I would not give my kids too much chocolate. I would expect all of us to be more responsible than that. Even aspirin has child safe caps on the bottles so I can easily say something as safe as aspirin shouldn't be freely given to kids.

  5. #235
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    Dude I get totally paranoid and shaky off a couple of Excedrin! Is it just me?
    Seriously!

  6. #236

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    TJ, you know Excedrin has caffeine. I had used it many times to help stay awake on long night time drives, kind of a double duty drug. You take a couple and you don't normally drink coffee, you're gonna shake!!!!

  7. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacklejunkie View Post
    Dude I get totally paranoid and shaky off a couple of Excedrin! Is it just me?
    Seriously!
    That's what happens to me when I drink one NOS energy drink, lol.

  8. #238
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    enegry drinks give me bubble guts haha

  9. #239

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyler View Post
    That's what happens to me when I drink one NOS energy drink, lol.
    NOS is freakin scary to me bro.
    I got a few free cases from work, of the larger bottles.
    First time i drank one i thought i was gunna die. I didn't even finish it. I acually like the taste though so i kept drinking them.

  10. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediMindTricks View Post
    i take offense to that man. seriously. **** pisses me off.
    i had a serious back injury when i was a kid, i took every pain killer in the book 4 to 8 times a day for years. a young *** kid. I went to a chriropractor 3 times a week for YEARS! Than one day, i had allergic reactions to the pills, my face would swell up, my lips only sometimes, maybe hives, not to mention how lazy some of those drugs make you. ever try to take percacets and goto school?

    long story short.......
    i became a certified insomniac, my stress level went through the roof, droped out of school, i lost sooooooooo much weight, didn't talk to my friends for over a year straight and at one point, i was so bad, i thought about the worst. sick i know.

    i **** you not! when i started smoking herb, weed, pot, ganja, whatever the **** you want to call it.

    i slept!
    i ate again!
    i can literally feel my spine loosin up after i smoke.
    i could go out with friends again.
    i was back man.

    i now have a job where i make $31 a hour and work mad double time hours. I have my own house with a 55inch LG plasma and a brand new Lifted F-150. I could go on. My point is i live a very nice life, im respected by my co-workers and friends and they all know i smoke pot. Heavily. And you wouldn't even know i was high. There just glad to have me back.

    so you can take that attitude and shove it man. Just because you dont like weed, doesn't mean it cant benefit someone else no matter what you say. Infact your opinion on it being bad means NOTHING anymore, because the proof is on our side now. Why do you think Arnold is thinking of legalizing it?
    WEED SAVED MY LIFE. LITERALLY.

    and about using the word herb to be socially exceptable, thats such BS. I could care less what you or anyone else thinks about it, or what word i use.

    i love WEED.
    So sorry to hear man. Even after taking an hour to read this whole thread, I tried to stay out of it, but I just want to put my two cents up now. Honestly, I have NEVER used marijuana in my life. Also, don't blame me as I don't know much about legalization of marijuana. I believe that marijuana should be legal to those who truly need it for a good purpose. Sure marijuana has the high effect, but doesn't seem to cause as much damage to the body when compared to alcohol or cigarettes. I know will be attacked for this, but hey, I'm only 17 and am still learning about politics and society. There are pros and cons to legalization, such as the ability to tax, with a con possibly being easy access and many more people getting high. Cigarettes kill, but Uncle Sam makes money off of it, as cannabis is natural and not stuffed with ammonia, nicotine, cyanide, tar, etc. I leave it for future taxpayers and voters to decide.

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