Caption Me

[DarkShadow]

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.3405025.1502511323!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/article-charlottesville-4-0811.jpg

Also, let's discuss.

[Natural Lefty]

Trump's Tribe

[Natural Lefty]

Were these the people at Unite the Right?

[DarkShadow]

Were these the people at Unite the Right?

Naw, it was the annual Black Friday Sale at Banana Republic. ;-)

*

I do love the use of Tiki torches tho. Nothing says "take back our country" than torches, from a culture who these guys probably want gone from the country.

Master Race? And you can't make your own torches?

http://www.prdaily.com/Uploads/Public/Tiki_Charlottesville_Response.png

The sad part? When the Tiki Company issues a stronger statement than our President, it puts things into perspective, doesn't it?

[Natural Lefty]

Are you sure it wasn't the Black Friday sale at Bass Pro Shops?

Tiki torches are Polynesian, not "American." Is that their idea of making America great again?

According to Google:

"Tiki torches originated from Polynesian culture. The word Tiki itself refers to wood and stone objects, carved to resemble human beings. The torches are a sign of fertility, and used in religious ceremonies to pay respects to the tiki gods."

[Natural Lefty]

Uh oh. I hope those torches don't improve these guys' fertility. :EyePop:

[Natural Lefty]

Here is their leader:

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20800090_10212289938877178_1330651627610781048_n.j pg?oh=d7a6c1b06c770c94dbe3e6b3564280ab&oe=5A34F913

[Lady Quagga]

https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/family-guy-the-quest-for-stuff/images/a/a0/Character-buzz-killington-facespace.png/revision/latest?cb=20140508161131

[CHUCKY]

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.3405025.1502511323!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/article-charlottesville-4-0811.jpg

Also, let's discuss.

This is what you get when you erase AMERICAN HISTORY. Why not remove the Lincoln memorial too while these greasy politicians are at it.

[Natural Lefty]

Oh, I get it. So these are a bunch of irate young history professors, huh? LOL

[CHUCKY]

Oh, I get it. So these are a bunch of irate young history professors, huh? LOL

Lol. No. A bunch of mad rednecks right there. Going at it the wrong way. They had their protest and ANTIFA attacked them so they gave them a beat down. What's wrong with defending themselves. If this was the other way around there would be no issue because it's ok to be PC.

[Natural Lefty]

I don't know if ANTIFA attacked them or not, but regarding the history, I just read that Robert E. Lee himself didn't want Civil War monuments to be displayed, even statues of himself.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/here%e2%80%99s-what-robert-e-lee-thought-about-confederate-monuments/ar-AAqdaUZ?li=BBnbfcL&ocid=HPCDHP

I do know that Heather Heyer didn't attack them.

[DarkShadow]

This is what you get when you erase AMERICAN HISTORY. Why not remove the Lincoln memorial too while these greasy politicians are at it.

Because last time I checked, Lincoln wasn't advocating splitting from this great country, all because they wanted to keep slavery alive for profit.

You're right, we can't erase Manzanar, or the Trail of Tears, or Jim Crow....

But we can put it where it belongs. In a museum.

[Natural Lefty]

Or slavery, or oppression, abuse and slaughter of native peoples going back to Christopher Columbus, or all the civilians that Americans killed (mostly from long distance by bombing) in nations such as Japan, Germany, North Korea and Vietnam, knowingly dropping them on civilian populations in order to terrorize and demoralize them.

That's not the sanitized version of history that kids get in school, but it's a real part of U.S. history. Actually, I think kids need to be exposed to this history, as well as having it in museums.

[DarkShadow]

Thanks NatLeft...

But im waiting for the response from the (suddenly absent) alt right.

[CHUCKY]

Thanks NatLeft...

But im waiting for the response from the (suddenly absent) alt right.
Far from alt right. But thanks. Why don't we remove any George Washington statues then. Where does it stop.?

[etucker1959]

Far from alt right. But thanks. Why don't we remove any George Washington statues then. Where does it stop.?

To compare a statue of a Confederate person to George Washington is a false equivalency!!! Normally they don't erect monuments to the "Loser's" (I thought Trump hated losers???) in a losing cause even though it's part of their history. I won't give the obvious example (Nazi Germany) but what about the leaders of South Vietnam. In Saigon, I doubt there is any statues of President Thieu there or monuments to the Americans who fight and died there. (maybe to the people who defeated them!!) People don't erect monuments to lost causes or the people who supported them. Unless they had an art-ial motive.

Ask your self when were those monuments erected??? They were erected in two time periods. The turn of the century (Jim Crow at it's peak) and the 1950's and 60's. (Civil rights movements in the South were going on big time) Those monuments were a poke in the eye to anyone who believed in Civil Rights for everyone.

I could go on about how Washington and Jefferson were nation builders. But the Confederate leaders were nation destroyers!!!! Do you now see how foolish that argument is, in comparing a Statue of Robert E. Lee to George Washington?????

If they tried to take down a statue of George Washington, (because he was a slave owner) "I would be there protesting myself!!!" I could give a history lesson "why" if I could get Seal's permission to do so!!! lol

[City Dad]

Anyone know where I can go to see a monument to all the brave Tories who died standing up for an ideal?

[etucker1959]

Anyone know where I can go to see a monument to all the brave Tories who died standing up for an ideal?

I almost used that example!!! For those who don't know, these were the loyalist Americans to the British crown during the American Revolution. (the most notable was Ben Franklin own son) 50,000 of them after the American Revolution moved to Canada.

[DarkShadow]

Far from alt right.

CHUCKY, that comment wasn't made for you, I'm sorry if it was misconstrued.

My comment was made for all the idiots who had ZERO problems posting their rhetoric before the election, and now that the fire has gotten real hot in the kitchen, are suddenly absent from these discussions.

In fact, I give you major props for standing up for your values and not chickening out.

The other confederate flag bearing guys? Not so much. Hawgz? Dev? Isn't this the perfect time for you to relive your stance on waving the confederate flag? Where are you guys at?

[Natural Lefty]

Here's another caption for you with a video, Dark Shadow.

Tiki Torch Nazis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fEMygEiSdc

[CHUCKY]

CHUCKY, that comment wasn't made for you, I'm sorry if it was misconstrued.

My comment was made for all the idiots who had ZERO problems posting their rhetoric before the election, and now that the fire has gotten real hot in the kitchen, are suddenly absent from these discussions.

In fact, I give you major props for standing up for your values and not chickening out.

The other confederate flag bearing guys? Not so much. Hawgz? Dev? Isn't this the perfect time for you to relive your stance on waving the confederate flag? Where are you guys at?

All good dude. Not mad at all. Dodgers are on and winning again!!

[steelhead]

That's the problem with you liberals, you like to lump everyone into boxes and appeal to extremes to make your argument. Only your moral compass is the one that counts and any dissenting opinion constitution be damned . So all Trump supporters are alt right, anyone that supports Trump is a racist and supports nazis?

So one crazy guy runs a person over and all Trump supporters are heaped on the coals as condoning his action and considered racist nazis but where's the equivalency when that Bernie supporter actually targeted republican congress and had them on a hit list? How many days did they keep that on the news cycle compared to Charlottesville? You know why there were no mass protest and upheaval when Obama won because people had jobs. What about the Antifa and BLM home bred terrorist who cover their faces and carry clubs and weapons at conservative rallies? How come the media is not calling them out? They were doing that well before the Charlottesville rally. I'm still waiting for fake news media to run a story on the old woman getting dragged by a scum antifa Piece of S#IT wearing a mask that dragged her.




Thanks NatLeft...

But im waiting for the response from the (suddenly absent) alt right.

[CHUCKY]

That's the problem with you liberals, you like to lump everyone into boxes and appeal to extremes to make your argument. Only your moral compass is the one that counts and any dissenting opinion constitution be damned . So all Trump supporters are alt right, anyone that supports Trump is a racist and supports nazis?

So one crazy guy runs a person over and all Trump supporters are heaped on the coals as condoning his action and considered racist nazis but where's the equivalency when that Bernie supporter actually targeted republican congress and had them on a hit list? How many days did they keep that on the news cycle compared to Charlottesville? You know why there were no mass protest and upheaval when Obama won because people had jobs. What about the Antifa and BLM home bred terrorist who cover their faces and carry clubs and weapons at conservative rallies? How come the media is not calling them out? They were doing that well before the Charlottesville rally. I'm still waiting for fake news media to run a story on the old woman getting dragged by a scum antifa Piece of S#IT wearing a mask that dragged her.

Steelhead, awesome !!!!! Two thumbs up.

[etucker1959]

That's the problem with you liberals, you like to lump everyone into boxes and appeal to extremes to make your argument. Only your moral compass is the one that counts and any dissenting opinion constitution be damned . So all Trump supporters are alt right, anyone that supports Trump is a racist and supports nazis?

So one crazy guy runs a person over and all Trump supporters are heaped on the coals as condoning his action and considered racist nazis but where's the equivalency when that Bernie supporter actually targeted republican congress and had them on a hit list? How many days did they keep that on the news cycle compared to Charlottesville? You know why there were no mass protest and upheaval when Obama won because people had jobs. What about the Antifa and BLM home bred terrorist who cover their faces and carry clubs and weapons at conservative rallies? How come the media is not calling them out? They were doing that well before the Charlottesville rally. I'm still waiting for fake news media to run a story on the old woman getting dragged by a scum antifa Piece of S#IT wearing a mask that dragged her.

Let me respond to your first line and stop before you get to the extreme part. Conservatives think they are so unique!!!! (there not!!!) You can "lump them into boxes" and how they got there is by either nurture, nature or environment or any combination of the three.

Let's compare the differences between a Conservative and a Progressive.

A Conservative believes in Individualism vs Collectivism which Progressives believe in. Other words to describe individualism is, what's in it for me, or every man for himself. (there is winners and losers and that's ok) When asked about what do we do with the loser's to a Conservative. A typical answer is, "not my problem" or "I can't worry about that!!!" The problem with that is, in the United States there is a every widening Wealth Gap!!! The Rich keep getting richer and the middle class or lower keep getting poorer. That was a big reason Donald Trump won the Presidency!!! He said, (lied) I will bring your jobs back and America will be "Great" again. He's doing a great job of that isn't he!!! (not!!)

A Progressive on the other hand wants everyone to win!!! They support a graduated tax basis. (based on the ability to pay) Or a safety net for all it's citizens. Even Obama Care which was an income redistribution of wealth. The Super Rich will pay for some of the less fortunate peoples Health Insurance. (see why Republicans hated it so much) Progressives can point to country's in Europe who don't have Super Rich people or Super Poor people. Everyone is sort of in the middle, as a better system then what we have in America.

I do want to respond to the famous deflection of the right wing pundits. (who you are quoting) They keep calling out the liberal press of why they aren't reporting of the sins of Hillary Clinton or someone else like that. Who cares???? She lost and she is not our President!!!! What part of the government is she controlling now???? Or what foreign policy is "SHE" carrying out???? She is doing nothing!!! President Trump is running the Executive Branch of our government. So he is fair game for the press to report on or even criticize what he does. Once again False Equivalency!!!! That is the new standard of being a Conservative!!!!

When you talk about the shooter of the Republican soft ball team. They were plenty of coverage on him!!! He was a lone shooter, the KKK or the Nazi's are a continues group that's going to set up rally's for years to come. (with thousands of supporters) As for other Left hate groups, "I condemn all of them" the problem is the right wing hate groups now feel empowered by Trump!! So there will be a lot more of them showing up for rally's, then anything the Left can come up with.

[Natural Lefty]

Yes, it's individualism and competition versus collectivism and cooperation in a nutshell. By the way, I just read that Trump's approval ratings are in the 30s in Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania, those 3 key states that he was expected to lose but won. Voters in those states also favor Dems for Congress.

LOL Steelhead, let me get this straight. You say that all liberals are alike because we lump conservatives together. Talk about a self-contradiction. Nobody is saying that all liberals or all conservatives are alike, but a lot of people get their cues from the same sources (nurture).

[Natural Lefty]

Regarding violence, this article cites a study which finds that right wing extremists cause far more violence than left wing extremists.

All the politicians who were assassinated while I was growing up -- MLK, JFK, Bobby Kennedy -- were liberals.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/factcheck/trump-asks-%e2%80%98what-about-the-alt-left%e2%80%99-here%e2%80%99s-an-answer/ar-AAqafJV?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=HPCDHP

[Brent]

That's the problem with you liberals, you like to lump everyone into boxes and appeal to extremes to make your argument. Only your moral compass is the one that counts and any dissenting opinion constitution be damned . So all Trump supporters are alt right, anyone that supports Trump is a racist and supports nazis?

So one crazy guy runs a person over and all Trump supporters are heaped on the coals as condoning his action and considered racist nazis but where's the equivalency when that Bernie supporter actually targeted republican congress and had them on a hit list? How many days did they keep that on the news cycle compared to Charlottesville? You know why there were no mass protest and upheaval when Obama won because people had jobs. What about the Antifa and BLM home bred terrorist who cover their faces and carry clubs and weapons at conservative rallies? How come the media is not calling them out? They were doing that well before the Charlottesville rally. I'm still waiting for fake news media to run a story on the old woman getting dragged by a scum antifa Piece of S#IT wearing a mask that dragged her.

Steelhead

I was just wondering if you read before you hit the post button.
"So one crazy guy runs a person over and all Trump supporters are heaped on the coals as condoning his action and considered racist nazis but where's the equivalency when that Bernie supporter actually targeted republican congress and had them on a hit list?"
You think this is the same? One crazy person runs over "a person"? He went full blast into a crowd EXACTLY like the ISIS terrorist in Spain did it. WTH? Unfortunately an innocent woman died, but fortunately a lot more didn't.
I'm not liberal or conservative, because they've both lost their way.. I will leave it best said by Forrest Gump "stupid is as stupid does" no matter the party affiliation.
I no more support these idiot antifa jacka$$ than you support the racist white supremacist and if you do support them, then well, we're kind of done with this conversation.
The people in the middle need to talk and help the rest to talk as well. Division will bring us all down and it won't matter what party you 'were'.

[CHUCKY]

steelhead

i was just wondering if you read before you hit the post button.
"so one crazy guy runs a person over and all trump supporters are heaped on the coals as condoning his action and considered racist nazis but where's the equivalency when that bernie supporter actually targeted republican congress and had them on a hit list?"
you think this is the same? One crazy person runs over "a person"? He went full blast into a crowd exactly like the isis terrorist in spain did it. Wth? Unfortunately an innocent woman died, but fortunately a lot more didn't.
I'm not liberal or conservative, because they've both lost their way.. I will leave it best said by forrest gump "stupid is as stupid does" no matter the party affiliation.
I no more support these idiot antifa jacka$$ than you support the racist white supremacist and if you do support them, then well, we're kind of done with this conversation.
The people in the middle need to talk and help the rest to talk as well. Division will bring us all down and it won't matter what party you 'were'.

img_3679.png

[CHUCKY]

img_3679.png

Dang. I'm new at this.

[steelhead]

There is nothing wrong with individualism, did they credit a group of people for inventing the lightbulb? How about the achievement of flight? Was it the Smith Brothers and the Henry Brothers and the Johnson brothers? How about the Ford automobile how come I don't see the Tucker household being part of the families that invented the model T? Aside from your flippant remarks your statements do not offer any substantive argument whatsoever, all you've succeeded is revealing to us how your come to your liberal views. You cry out we're the product of our environment, we weren't afforded the opportunities so we ended up working in dead end jobs and complaining about low wages and now demand a living wage... we grew up in the ghetto so it forced us to become criminals... we were raised in broken families, etc, etc so dont hold us responsible because were are victims!....


Let me respond to your first line and stop before you get to the extreme part. Conservatives think they are so unique!!!! (there not!!!) You can "lump them into boxes" and how they got there is by either nurture, nature or environment or any combination of the three.

Let's compare the differences between a Conservative and a Progressive.

A Conservative believes in Individualism vs Collectivism which Progressives believe in. Other words to describe individualism is, what's in it for me, or every man for himself. (there is winners and losers and that's ok) When asked about what do we do with the loser's to a Conservative. A typical answer is, "not my problem" or "I can't worry about that!!!" The problem with that is, in the United States there is a every widening Wealth Gap!!! The Rich keep getting richer and the middle class or lower keep getting poorer. That was a big reason Donald Trump won the Presidency!!! He said, (lied) I will bring your jobs back and America will be "Great" again. He's doing a great job of that isn't he!!! (not!!)

A Progressive on the other hand wants everyone to win!!! They support a graduated tax basis. (based on the ability to pay) Or a safety net for all it's citizens. Even Obama Care which was an income redistribution of wealth. The Super Rich will pay for some of the less fortunate Health Insurance. (see why Republicans hated it so much) Progressives can point to country's in Europe who don't have Super Rich people or Super Poor people. Everyone is sort of in the middle, as a better system then what we have in America.

I do want to respond to the famous deflection of the right wing pundits. (who you are quoting) They keep calling out the liberal press of why they aren't reporting of the sins of Hillary Clinton or someone else like that. Who cares???? She lost and she is not our President!!!! What part of the government is she controlling now???? Or what foreign policy is "SHE" carrying out???? She is doing nothing!!! President Trump is running the Executive Branch of our government. So he is fair game for the press to report on or even criticize what he does. Once again False Equivalency!!!! That is the new standard of being a Conservative!!!!

When you talk about the shooter of the Republican soft ball team. They were plenty of coverage on him!!! He was a lone shooter, the KKK or the Nazi's are a continues group that's going to set up rally's for years to come. (with thousands of supporters) As for other Left hate groups, "I condemn all of them" the problem is the right wing hate groups now feel empowered by Trump!! So there will be a lot more of them showing up for rally's, then anything the Left can come up with.

[CHUCKY]

There is nothing wrong with individualism, did they credit a group of people for inventing the lightbulb? How about the achievement of flight? Was it the Smith Brothers and the Henry Brothers and the Johnson brothers? How about the Ford automobile how come I don't see the Tucker household being part of the families that invented the model T? Aside from your flippant remarks your statements do not offer any substantive argument whatsoever, all you've succeeded is revealing to us how your come to your liberal views. You cry out we're the product of our environment, we weren't afforded the opportunities so we ended up working in dead end jobs and complaining about low wages and now demand a living wage... we grew up in the ghetto so it forced us to become criminals... we were raised in broken families, etc, etc so dont hold us responsible because were are victims!....

Dang. Well said

[Natural Lefty]

Actually, it takes collaborative effort from a lot of people in order to invent something useful and make it available to the public.

[etucker1959]

There is nothing wrong with individualism, did they credit a group of people for inventing the lightbulb? How about the achievement of flight? Was it the Smith Brothers and the Henry Brothers and the Johnson brothers? How about the Ford automobile how come I don't see the Tucker household being part of the families that invented the model T? Aside from your flippant remarks your statements do not offer any substantive argument whatsoever, all you've succeeded is revealing to us how your come to your liberal views. You cry out we're the product of our environment, we weren't afforded the opportunities so we ended up working in dead end jobs and complaining about low wages and now demand a living wage... we grew up in the ghetto so it forced us to become criminals... we were raised in broken families, etc, etc so dont hold us responsible because were are victims!....

Let me address your statement about how I came to my Liberal views. I voted Republican from 1980-2000 and proud of it!! In 2000 I liked where the country was at with things like a balanced budget and a roaring economy. In 2000 I voted for Al Gore because I thought things would continue economically going great for the country. In my heart I couldn't vote for little Bush!!! (Dumb) In 2016, I couldn't in good conscious vote for (puxxx grabbing) Donald Trump either. (Dumber) So if you voted for the last 2 Republican Presidents who got elected, (Dumb & Dumber) you should not be surprised by all the chaos (what would you expect from Dumber) that is now going on in the White House. If you were to try to tell me things would be worse with Hillary in there!!!! If you were to say that, "I would have to call you what ever comes past Dumb & Dumber."

[steelhead]

Aren't you glad that you live in the United States where you can have differing opinions and be able to voice them without the threat of violence and/or retaliation? Or at least Americans used to be able to do that until recently. That is until terrorist groups like Antifa and BLM reared their ugly heads and were too dumb to know that they were guilty of the very principles they thought they for- nothing but a bunch of hypocrites. You do not have to look far, right here in Laguna Beach this afternoon there was a rally by those who were victims of crimes by illegal immigrants. Would you say that those who were violated by illegal immigrants have a valid reason to voice their concern?? Before you go regurgitating liberal talking points about how there are also white terrorist and christian killers and legal killers- I agree with you but do we need to import the illegal variety too?

The violent Antifa showed up with their black garb and mask and threatened them and the situation got out of control with the original rally members having to defend themself. Go google it and you'll see it reported with eyewitness accounts from those who were there, it won't be heavily covered because it doesn't fit the liberal narrative.

[steelhead]

Brent, unfortunately there's no middle ground anymore, it is beyond their tunnel vision to think there could be Trump conservatives who abhor racism and what nazis stand for the democrats on here think there is only absolute black and white. For those on here who like to paint with a broad brush anything conservative is evil nowadays. Regarding the attacks I don't think you can say one case is worse than the others, they are both equally bad, one was premeditated with an assasination list. I'm not a party line voter, I've voted for presidents on both sides but the democrats now are so far LEFT it's not the left of President Clinton. Etucker said he had an epiphany and turned liberal? Here's my epiphany I'm not for men going into women's bathroom because they happen to feel effeminate that day. Yes that is a FACT that federal mandates were handed down by BHO before he left office to the grade schools no less and yes you can go into a TARGET store today and go into a women's room because you identify as a woman. Etucker likes to paint with a broad brush to say rich corporations against the working class poor what he doesn't understand is the middleclass was the ones getting screwed by the last administration. If people want to get ahead in life work for it and don't blame anyone for your shortcomings or misfortunes. I've heard dozens of SOB stories paraded by the media to propagandize a position but to put it back in Tucker's court as he was the one that said people in general shouldn't feel "unique". Guess what One SOB story is no more compelling than the next, no your SOB stories and all the other SOB stories are also not unique! Take accountability for any action or inaction that lead you to your current standing.

[etucker1959]

Aren't you glad that you live in the United States where you can have differing opinions and be able to voice them without the threat of violence and/or retaliation? Or at least Americans used to be able to do that until recently. That is until terrorist groups like Antifa and BLM reared their ugly heads and were too dumb to know that they were guilty of the very principles they thought they for- nothing but a bunch of hypocrites. You do not have to look far, right here in Laguna Beach this afternoon there was a rally by those who were victims of crimes by illegal immigrants. Would you say that those who were violated by illegal immigrants have a valid reason to voice their concern?? Before you go regurgitating liberal talking points about how there are also white terrorist and christian killers and legal killers- I agree with you but do we need to import the illegal variety too?

The violent Antifa showed up with their black garb and mask and threatened them and the situation got out of control with the original rally members having to defend themself. Go google it and you'll see it reported with eyewitness accounts from those who were there, it won't be heavily covered because it doesn't fit the liberal narrative.

You bring up the point about crimes committed by illegal aliens. Who's defending that???? No one!!! Obama when he was President was known as the "Deporter in Chief!!!" Trump comes along like he just invented the wheel. Saying things like, "I'm going to deport these Bad Hombres out of here!!!" Sorry to tell you Mr. Trump, last time I saw the numbers, you haven't even equaled what Obama was doing in that department yet!!! Typical Trump, trying to take credit for something that was already happening with or without him!!! When is he going to do something totally unique to his "Presidency" that is positive!!!! I'm still waiting!!!!!

[Brent]

Brent, unfortunately there's no middle ground anymore, it is beyond their tunnel vision to think there could be Trump conservatives who abhor racism and what nazis stand for the democrats on here think there is only absolute black and white. For those on here who like to paint with a broad brush anything conservative is evil nowadays. Regarding the attacks I don't think you can say one case is worse than the others, they are both equally bad, one was premeditated with an assasination list. I'm not a party line voter, I've voted for presidents on both sides but the democrats now are so far LEFT it's not the left of President Clinton. Etucker said he had an epiphany and turned liberal? Here's my epiphany I'm not for men going into women's bathroom because they happen to feel effeminate that day. Yes that is a FACT that federal mandates were handed down by BHO before he left office to the grade schools no less and yes you can go into a TARGET store today and go into a women's room because you identify as a woman. Etucker likes to paint with a broad brush to say rich corporations against the working class poor what he doesn't understand is the middleclass was the ones getting screwed by the last administration. If people want to get ahead in life work for it and don't blame anyone for your shortcomings or misfortunes. I've heard dozens of SOB stories paraded by the media to propagandize a position but to put it back in Tucker's court as he was the one that said people in general shouldn't feel "unique". Guess what One SOB story is no more compelling than the next, no your SOB stories and all the other SOB stories are also not unique! Take accountability for any action or inaction that lead you to your current standing.

While I do agree on some points, you still have no way to comment on societies injustices to the black and poor who have been held down and ***** on for hundreds of years. The discrimination and abuse does make for blacks to be poor, uneducated and criminalized. You are not black or you would not be saying those things. To think that because white men decide one day that, oh, racism is over go to work, then it's done is a really dumb thing to think.
There are hundreds of years of persecution, abuse and discrimination to turn back the other way and these f'ing nazi wanna be's demonstrators just prove that. Just telling people, "get a job and make it better" is not going to do a damn thing. This is hundreds of years of abuse that has to be undone and it will be a lot harder to undo than it was to create in the first place.
Please don't be one of those people. I'm married to black woman from inner Detroit and have witnessed in my brief dealings what centuries of abuse and discrimination can do to peoples spirits, minds, thoughts and well being.
We've beat back racism in the Civil War and WW2 and will do it again at all costs. Trump has freed these closeted racist and now the lid can't be put back on the can of worms.
I despise Antifa and feel they do way more harm than good by mixing with liberal peaceful protesters and that causes the broad brush painting of the liberal protesters as you mentioned.
The nazi protesters on the other hand. They need to go back under their rocks and go away. There is no place in today's world for that kind of hate and they deserve any horrrble ***** that happens to them. Yes, they have freedom of speech, but so does everyone else and everyone else also has the right to react to their hate speech.
If you want to remain 'pure' white, then I have zero problem with that, just don't try to say we all have to be hateful about it as well. none of those white 'pure' bozos are actually 'pure' anyway. We all come from the same place if you track it back all the way, so go figure. At some point, some decided they were better because of the color of their skin. Stupidest thing ever.
As for the bathroom issue, please show where any trans sexual have attacked anyone in a bathroom. Sorry but, perverted white men are %90+ of the perpetrators. and they look like you and me, not Bruce/Kaitlen Jenner.
100's of times more white 'christian' politicians have done way worse than any trans people ever.
Facts will set you free

[etucker1959]

Brent, unfortunately there's no middle ground anymore, it is beyond their tunnel vision to think there could be Trump conservatives who abhor racism and what nazis stand for the democrats on here think there is only absolute black and white. For those on here who like to paint with a broad brush anything conservative is evil nowadays. Regarding the attacks I don't think you can say one case is worse than the others, they are both equally bad, one was premeditated with an assasination list. I'm not a party line voter, I've voted for presidents on both sides but the democrats now are so far LEFT it's not the left of President Clinton. Etucker said he had an epiphany and turned liberal? Here's my epiphany I'm not for men going into women's bathroom because they happen to feel effeminate that day. Yes that is a FACT that federal mandates were handed down by BHO before he left office to the grade schools no less and yes you can go into a TARGET store today and go into a women's room because you identify as a woman. Etucker likes to paint with a broad brush to say rich corporations against the working class poor what he doesn't understand is the middleclass was the ones getting screwed by the last administration. If people want to get ahead in life work for it and don't blame anyone for your shortcomings or misfortunes. I've heard dozens of SOB stories paraded by the media to propagandize a position but to put it back in Tucker's court as he was the one that said people in general shouldn't feel "unique". Guess what One SOB story is no more compelling than the next, no your SOB stories and all the other SOB stories are also not unique! Take accountability for any action or inaction that lead you to your current standing.

BREAKING NEWS BREAKING NEWS BREAKING NEWS

Private enterprise has made the first steps in solving the Bathroom issue.

Taco Bell and the Hot Dog chain has turned all their Bathrooms to Sea Horse bathrooms with locks. In other words, anyone can use any bathroom regardless of sex. Just lock the door once your in there. That's just a start, but all new Bathroom construction could incoporate something like that!!!!!

[Brent]

BREAKING NEWS BREAKING NEWS BREAKING NEWS

Private enterprise has made the first steps in solving the Bathroom issue.

Taco Bell and the Hot Dog chain has turned all their Bathrooms to Sea Horse bathrooms with locks. In other words, anyone can use any bathroom regardless of sex. Just lock the door once your in there. That's just a start, but all new Bathroom construction could incoporate something like that!!!!!

I have a question.
Does anyone here have separate bathrooms for men and women in their house?
I know, but you won't be in there at the same time?????? I don't have these man/woman thingy's trying to use my bathroom???
Why do you care how a person wants to use the bathroom? Everyone does it everyday.
The sickos are not the trans-gendered. Look at the statistics on sexual assaults in bathrooms. Young to middle aged white men that look like you or me.
Just as proposed, make small private locking stalls to give everyone privacy

[DarkShadow]

That's the problem with you liberals, you like to lump everyone into boxes and appeal to extremes to make your argument.

I'm already late to the party, but if you don't see the irony in this statement, then that's exactly the problem.


So all Trump supporters are alt right, anyone that supports Trump is a racist and supports nazis?

No, we are saying that all Nazis, Fascists, White Nationalists are racist and are Trump supporters. Not that hard a concept.

[Natural Lefty]

Brent, my graduate school advisor was a black woman from inner city Detroit, at U.C. Riverside. Her politics would make what Steelhead calls radical left look lame. I learned a lot from her. ;) But I was always a liberal, from childhood. I couldn't stand Reagan even as a governor when I was a kid. And my wife is an immigrant, from Taiwan. Now, the Trump administration wants to cut legal immigration in half, another bad move.

Yes, Eric, the Trump administration is doing a lot of "unpresidented" things. The problem, as you say, is that none of them are good.

About the violence again, I posted an article in this thread with statistics that right wing extremists in the U.S. have killed 12 times as many, and injured 36 times as many, people as have left wing extremists. Here it is again. It is in response to Trump's claims that both sides were equally to blame in Charlottesville. http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/factcheck/trump-asks-%e2%80%98what-about-the-alt-left%e2%80%99-here%e2%80%99s-an-answer/ar-AAqafJV?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=HPCDHP

And just to clean up a final point about responsibility and jobs, etc., I believe in taking responsibility too. I don't think you will find many people who don't believe in that, at least in principle. But the world isn't that simple. We all have different talents and weaknesses. Liberals understand that, and know also that there are some people who need help. They may be good people, but there are things that they cannot do for themselves. We are all born helpless. There is no such thing, really, as a self-made person. Our task is to learn and evolve and help people, not to be the winner of some sort of grand greed competition.

People getting jobs is fine, but when they don't pay enough, as in "right to work" states, they still struggle to get by. We need to raise the national minimum wage considerably. But also, the nature of the job market and work is changing. This is not the 1950s anymore. Technology has made many jobs unnecessary and replaced them with machinery, for one thing. Work has become more efficient therefore, but there are fewer jobs available. The end result of technological advances is that more can get done with less work, potentially freeing people to work part time or pursue productive activities of interest to them. The question that occurs to me is whether we will share resources equitably and people will have enough to be happy, comfortable and secure, and live productive lives, or whether the ultra wealthy will suck up all the money, keep the rest of us relatively poor and insecure, and unable to live productive lives.

[steelhead]

You are citing bias media talking points because you've heard it repeated countless times when you don't know the context behind these so called "deportations". During the last administration they redefined what was considered a deportation, anyone who was caught or turned away at the border was considered in those numbers. There is a reason why the border patrols was up in arms about the direction given to them by President Obama. They were hamstrung from doing their jobs because they were told to stand down. Why do you think they came out and endorsed Trump during the campaign and have you heard the percentage of those attempting to cross illegally is drastically down from years past? Do you know what is also going to happen with stricter enforcement of immigration laws moving forward? Lawlessness and crimes committed by illegals will also drop because under the new policy any law enforcement coming into contact with illegals can lead to deportation. Under the last administration and even to this day there are dozens of cities who will not comply with federal laws to hold illegal violent felons! Are you democrats for that too??



You bring up the point about crimes committed by illegal aliens. Who's defending that???? No one!!! Obama when he was President was known as the "Deporter in Chief!!!" Trump comes along like he just invented the wheel. Saying things like, "I'm going to deport these Bad Hombres out of here!!!" Sorry to tell you Mr. Trump, last time I saw the numbers, you haven't even equaled what Obama was doing in that department yet!!! Typical Trump, trying to take credit for something that was already happening with or without him!!! When is he going to do something totally unique to his "Presidency" that is positive!!!! I'm still waiting!!!!!

[DarkShadow]

I'll play!


You are citing bias media talking points because you've heard it repeated countless times when you don't know the context behind these so called "deportations".

Neither do "Trump supporters." Funny how that works on both sides, depending on what side you're on!


During the last administration they redefined what was considered a deportation, anyone who was caught or turned away at the border was considered in those numbers. There is a reason why the border patrols was up in arms about the direction given to them by President Obama. They were hamstrung from doing their jobs because they were told to stand down. Why do you think they came out and endorsed Trump during the campaign and have you heard the percentage of those attempting to cross illegally is drastically down from years past? Do you know what is also going to happen with stricter enforcement of immigration laws moving forward? Lawlessness and crimes committed by illegals will also drop because under the new policy any law enforcement coming into contact with illegals can lead to deportation. Under the last administration and even to this day there are dozens of cities who will not comply with federal laws to hold illegal violent felons! Are you democrats for that too??


You are citing bias media talking points because you've heard it repeated countless times when you don't know the context behind these so called "deportations".

When someone can use your own arguments against yourself, you need to think up new arguments. Much like when you cast a blanket on anybody who's against trump being a "Libtard," then saying "Libtards" think anybody who supports Trump is a Nazi.

[steelhead]

Wow, you really got me there....I'm stating a fact with regards to the deportations and you state your opinion, at this rate you're not going to get that high score you were hoping for, might cost you a few more quarters but keep trying.

So what did liberals expect? When you tell me how ironic it is that i'm redirecting the criticism at you it's irony? So are conservative to lay down and play nice? Here is a comparison for you, who has been protesting and rioting and instigating mayhem and civil unrest after the election. While you're comparing how come we didn't see that after 2008 and 2012?


I'll play!



Neither do "Trump supporters." Funny how that works on both sides, depending on what side you're on!





When someone can use your own arguments against yourself, you need to think up new arguments. Much like when you cast a blanket on anybody who's against trump being a "Libtard," then saying "Libtards" think anybody who supports Trump is a Nazi.

[DarkShadow]

Wow, you really got me there....I'm stating a fact with regards to the deportations and you state your opinion, at this rate you're not going to get that high score you were hoping for, might cost you a few more quarters but keep trying.

Quarters? Perhaps that's why we differ in opinion, since we're no longer in 1965. You're playing Pole Position, and we're over here in 2017, much like the guys waving those Confederate flags in Virginia thinking "The South Will Rise Again!" still think they're 5 score and 7 years ago.

(But we all know you don't affiliate with them, you just embrace the same time period and ideology.)

And again, you state a "fact" being based on your own opinion should be taken as truth, yet you negate MY factual opinions?


So what did liberals expect? When you tell me how ironic it is that i'm redirecting the criticism at you it's irony? So are conservative to lay down and play nice? Here is a comparison for you, who has been protesting and rioting and instigating mayhem and civil unrest after the election. While you're comparing how come we didn't see that after 2008 and 2012?

I believe others already shot down this argument (hint, earlier today, scroll up). Now, if you didn't elect to read those arguments, not my fault, but I'll definitely let those responses do the talking, and let you do the responding by scrolling up.

Although I already feel the "New York Times is fake news" argument coming up. I give Trump one thing...

He's definitely given his base very basic talking points that they all can gather around with.

I never though the K.I.S.S mentality would catch on. But then I have to re-read George Carlin's epic quote....

[Brent]

Kills me when Republican apologist bring up "There were no riots when Obama was elected". As if they should get a cookie.
That's most likely because the country and the world as a matter of fact were not being threatened. Please see results of previous 8 years under Obama if you need proof that the world wasn't ending.
When you elect a clown that supports racist elements and insults every country and person that do not support him, expect people with sense to resist. Please see first 6 months under Trump.
It really is that simple.
If anyone else had been elected, let's say Paul Ryan for example. People would be pissed, me included, but I wouldn't feel like we just made the worst mistake of our entire countries existence like I did and still do about Trump. It's all very relative.

[Natural Lefty]

Let's talk about what in fact happened after the 2008 election, Steelhead. Republicans in Congress cynically vowed to oppose everything that the Obama administration was trying to accomplish. and this "party of no" opposition also became characteristic of the so-called "Tea Party."

Here is an article about it. This was a full fledged Republican conspiracy against Obama and the Democrats. http://swampland.time.com/2012/08/23/the-party-of-no-new-details-on-the-gop-plot-to-obstruct-obama/

[etucker1959]

Wow, you really got me there....I'm stating a fact with regards to the deportations and you state your opinion, at this rate you're not going to get that high score you were hoping for, might cost you a few more quarters but keep trying.

So what did liberals expect? When you tell me how ironic it is that i'm redirecting the criticism at you it's irony? So are conservative to lay down and play nice? Here is a comparison for you, who has been protesting and rioting and instigating mayhem and civil unrest after the election. While you're comparing how come we didn't see that after 2008 and 2012?

I've got to respond to this. You talk about protesting and civil unrest after the election of 2016. Yet you say they were no protesting in 2008 and 2012 after Obama won. There was the same viger of protesting, but it was age bias. In 2016 young people both men and women took to the streets to protest the election results. In 2008 and in 2012 the "OLD mostly White people protested too!!" It was called the Tea Party movement!!!! Since they were mostly old white people who couldn't march. They instead had thousands of Town Hall meetings to protest Obama Presidency!!! Does any of this sound familiar???? Did I jog you memory at all??? It was a protest, just in a different form based on their age. Where is the Tea Party Now???? Back at home in their Rockin Chairs since the Republicans now control the government. If the Democrats win back control of the government in say 2020, do you not think they will be some kind of movement protesting them???? Of course there will be!!! It's amazing how you Conservatives only see things that fit your mind set.

[steelhead]

Yes I do remember the tea party movement and no it was no where near the same level of violence,
property destruction that antifa terrorists and BLM have wreaked in their protest. The democrat party has hitched their wagons to these movements but BLM started from Obama and Eric holder's corrupt DOJ taking the side of a criminal over a policeman. It's funny how you all criticize the president for putting his foot in his mouth but everyone overlooks the fact that the last president jumped out in front of a story and sided with the criminal before all the facts were out. His own keystone DOJ run by the racist Holder tried as they may was unable to prove misconduct on the part of the policeman who was attacked. All this while a good part of Missouri burned down and a few years later and dozens of policeman killed and wounded in the line of duty because of the divider in chief. Thanks democrats


I've got to respond to this. You talk about protesting and civil unrest after the election of 2016. Yet you say they were no protesting in 2008 and 2012 after Obama won. There was the same viger of protesting, but it was age bias. In 2016 young people both men and women took to the streets to protest the election results. In 2008 and in 2012 the "OLD mostly White people protested too!!" It was called the Tea Party movement!!!! Since they were mostly old white people who couldn't march. They instead had thousands of Town Hall meetings to protest Obama Presidency!!! Does any of this sound familiar???? Did I jog you memory at all??? It was a protest, just in a different form based on their age. Where is the Tea Party Now???? Back at home in their Rockin Chairs since the Republicans now control the government. If the Democrats win back control of the government in say 2020, do you not think they will be some kind of movement protesting them???? Of course there will be!!! It's amazing how you Conservatives only see things that fit your mind set.

[steelhead]

Yes BO sat idly by twiddling his thumb allowing the world to run roughshod over the U.S. Bending over backwards to put together a sham of a nuclear deal with Iran while sending them hundreds of millions of dollars... yah yah it was there money to begin with if you believe that fake news, convenient that it was sent to them on same day that hostages were released. Or allowing North Korea to go un check and continuing with the disaster that is known as NAFTA taking jobs away from Americans. The very fact that countries like Mexico, Canada and China are taking a different tone in wanting to renegotiate with Trump means they know they've been living off the fat all these years. And here you sit back and criticize Trump for being undiplomatic while fake news actually gave Kim Jong a higher grade than Trump in handling the missile test crisis. There are a dozen countries in Asia that would love you commies. Anything else?

[DarkShadow]

That's the problem with you liberals, you like to lump everyone into boxes and appeal to extremes to make your argument.

And then you say this?


There are a dozen countries in Asia that would love you commies.

•

And....a dozen?

Name a dozen Communist countries in Asia.

[etucker1959]

Yes BO sat idly by twiddling his thumb allowing the world to run roughshod over the U.S. Bending over backwards to put together a sham of a nuclear deal with Iran while sending them hundreds of millions of dollars... yah yah it was there money to begin with if you believe that fake news, convenient that it was sent to them on same day that hostages were released. Or allowing North Korea to go un check and continuing with the disaster that is known as NAFTA taking jobs away from Americans. The very fact that countries like Mexico, Canada and China are taking a different tone in wanting to renegotiate with Trump means they know they've been living off the fat all these years. And here you sit back and criticize Trump for being undiplomatic while fake news actually gave Kim Jong a higher grade than Trump in handling the missile test crisis. There are a dozen countries in Asia that would love you commies. Anything else?

I watch and read all kinds of different News outlets. To make things easy, why don't you tell us all "who" reports the Real News??? That should be a simple question to answer.

[steelhead]

I didnt know only Hillary supporters had the right to criticize, you're right you're all for free speech and freedom of expression until someone else's expression doesn't agree with yours. So in your ideal world everybody who doesn't support your opinion to remain quiet while you fascists have your way... right..



And then you say this?



•

And....a dozen?

Name a dozen Communist countries in Asia.

Holy crap you pointed out an inaccurate statement, there isn't 12 in Asia. I was wrong, anything other gotcha moments you've discovered?

[steelhead]

You watch all news outlets and have quoted several of them which i've already pointed out as being mouthpieces for Democratic party. You and Darkshadow have oft quoted on CNN, ABC, Wash Post and they've all being caught putting forth false storylines to fit their agenda. The falsehoods are too numerous for me to cite here and others have done plenty to point that out. Read the Fake news story post started by Dark shadow for examples :-)

[etucker1959]

You watch all news outlets and have quoted several of them which i've already pointed out as being mouthpieces for Democratic party. You and Darkshadow have oft quoted on CNN, ABC, Wash Post and they've all being caught putting forth false storylines to fit their agenda. The falsehoods are too numerous for me to cite here and others have done plenty to point that out. Read the Fake news story post started by Dark shadow for examples :-)

You are avoiding my direct question. Who or What in your opinion reports the Real News????? I want to know this, so I can start watching, listening or reading the Truth!!!! You can't claim Fake News without disclosing what or who is reporting the Real News.

[steelhead]

I've mentioned this before in other posts, there isn't a definitive authority on real news. When your inclination is to believe that NYT has to be real or Fox news or ABC as being purveyors of truth then unless they report something so salacious and untrue you will tend to take them at their word. That is not me, I don't have a go to source, I watch all media outlets ane make up my own mind. Have you seen me quote any conservative news source to defend my opinion? Never


You are avoiding my direct question. Who or What in your opinion reports the Real News????? I want to know this, so I can start watching, listening or reading the Truth!!!! You can't claim Fake News without disclosing what or who is reporting the Real News.

[Ssortasober]

. have oft quoted on CNN, ABC, Wash Post and they've all being caught putting forth false storylines to fit their agenda. The falsehoods are too numerous for me to cite here and others have done plenty to point that out. Read the Fake news story post started by Dark shadow for examples :-)

Come on dude, while I think you have brought up some valid points,
Our president Dosent know how to speak the truth. Really, how can anyone defend this guy? He is full of ****.
Even his own party is backing away from him.

[Natural Lefty]

So, now we are liberal commie fascists? LOL That's a contradiction in terms.

Here is the definition of fascism: "fas·cism.
.
[ˈfaSHˌizəm]


NOUN


an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization."


Congratulations, Steelhead: You have just won a year's supply of Covfefe and a free bag of Alternative Facts. It's "Unpresidented."

[etucker1959]

I've mentioned this before in other posts, there isn't a definitive authority on real news. When your inclination is to believe that NYT has to be real or Fox news or ABC as being purveyors of truth then unless they report something so salacious and untrue you will tend to take them at their word. That is not me, I don't have a go to source, I watch all media outlets ane make up my own mind. Have you seen me quote any conservative news source to defend my opinion? Never

Ok, so we have Fake News and "not a definitive News agency" who reports the Truth. That's a convenient way to judge News sources if your the President or one of his followers.

What about the Presidents own mouth??? The Fake News outlets are reporting in the 7 months President Trump been in office. He's told 1,058 lies since he's been President. (he hasn't retracted or apologized for any of them that I know about) Yet what you and other's call Fake News, when something is pointed out as being inaccurate as they reported it. They will then retract, apologizes and some cases "Fire the reporter's who reported inaccurate facts!!!"

So with that standard, when do we fire the President????? lol Mitch McConnell said today, "Trumps Presidency is doomed to fail!!!" Face facts, anyone who hitches their wagon to the failed Trump train. Will go down in Flames with him!!!!

[steelhead]

Tucker, be part of the RESIST movement rinse and repeat! So Now Mitch McConnell speaks for all conservatives? My portfolios are going through the roof and it's only going to get better with the tax cuts proposed. Thanks for all the losing huh??



Ok, so we have Fake News and "not a definitive News agency" who reports the Truth. That's a convenient way to judge News sources if your the President or one of his followers.

What about the Presidents own mouth??? The Fake News outlets are reporting in the 7 months President Trump been in office. He's told 1,058 lies since he's been President. (he hasn't retracted or apologized for any of them that I know about) Yet what you and other's call Fake News, when something is pointed out as being inaccurate as they reported it. They will then retract, apologizes and some cases "Fire the reporter's who reported inaccurate facts!!!"

So with that standard, when do we fire the President????? lol Mitch McConnell said today, "Trumps Presidency is doomed to fail!!!" Face facts, anyone who hitches their wagon to the failed Trump train. Will go down in Flames with him!!!!

[etucker1959]

Tucker, be part of the RESIST movement rinse and repeat! So Now Mitch McConnell speaks for all conservatives? My portfolios are going through the roof and it's only going to get better with the tax cuts proposed. Thanks for all the losing huh??

Mitch McConnell leader of the Senate, does speak for all Conservatives if you want some legislation passed!!! Such as your "TAX CUTS!!" Come on Steelhead your making this too easy!!!! Trump did increase the rise in the stock market some what. But you really also have to thank Janice Yelstein of the Feds. (I think I got her name right) Her policy's now are driving the Stock Market increases more then anything Trump does. The Stock Market doesn't like unpredictable events. If Trump was driving the Market now, it wouldn't be doing as well as it is. (Thank the Feds for that) What happens if the Republicans can't get tax reform done. (it's not a done deal by any stretch of the imagination) Are your stocks going to then stumble and tumble???? I don't think so, because the Trump effect is really not driving the market any more!!!!

[etucker1959]

And then you say this?



•

And....a dozen?

Name a dozen Communist countries in Asia.

I came up with 5 Communist countries in Asia. 1. North Korea 2. China 3. Vietnam 4. Laos 5. Cambodia

[DarkShadow]

Come on dude, while I think you have brought up some valid points,
Our president Dosent know how to speak the truth. Really, how can anyone defend this guy? He is full of ****.
Even his own party is backing away from him.

But the problem is, a lot of his rabid voting base doubled down time after time during the campaign.

So now it's time to back up their choice, or admit they made a bad decision.

And pigs will sooner fly before that happens.



So, now we are liberal commie fascists? LOL That's a contradiction in terms.

Yeah, I saw that too.

We're fascists and antifas now.

Which one is it? You can't be both.

:LOL:

[Natural Lefty]

Oh yeah, we are fascists and antifascists at the same time. LOL How does that work?

[DarkShadow]

Oh yeah, we are fascists and antifascists at the same time. LOL How does that work?

The constant contradictions, reference to fake statistics, blanket arguments and otherwise illogical talking points sure reminds me of some one.

https://www.edweek.org/media/2016/05/13/31-insiders-donald-trump-silhouette-600.jpg

Apparently the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree.

You see that awesome speech from Phoenix?

Wish he condemned the Nazis as vociferously as he does the media.

[steelhead]

Yes Lefty showed me he can google the meaning of fascism and provided a definition and here you are spouting the same but maybe i need to scale it up a bit since you think as liberals you are so vastly superior and more educated because according to the polls and surveys liberals are the smartest people!
The antifascists by name are actually practicing fascism and carrying out the very acts of fascism that they think they are fighting against... To suppress free thought and any opposition that doesn't jive with their own ideologies. Opinions that goes against the media outlet propaganda is considered fringe and discounted out of hand. The DNC and only democrats know what is best for you!
Riot Shower and Repeat soldiers of the resistance, I salute you



The constant contradictions, reference to fake statistics, blanket arguments and otherwise illogical talking points sure reminds me of some one.

https://www.edweek.org/media/2016/05/13/31-insiders-donald-trump-silhouette-600.jpg

Apparently the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree.

You see that awesome speech from Phoenix?

Wish he condemned the Nazis as vociferously as he does the media.

[DarkShadow]

Yes Lefty showed me he can google the meaning of fascism and provided a definition and here you are spouting the same.

Definition? Definition or not, you just called "us liberals" AntiFas in the beginning, then called us fascists. No definition was needed to show your contradiction. You did it all by yourself.


but maybe i need to scale it up a bit since you think as liberals you are so vastly superior and more educated because according to the polls and surveys liberals are the smartest people!

Hey, I'm not the one who just called "us liberals" antifascists and fascists in the same thread. That was all your doing.


The antifascists by name are actually practicing fascism and carrying out the very acts of fascism that they think they are fighting against...

You can't call us fascists because these guys already embraced the name.

http://a.abcnews.com/images/Politics/White-supremecists-as-rx-01-170815_12x5_992.jpg

You'll have to choose something else.


Soldiers of the resistance, I salute you

Yeah, because being a soldier against Nazis and white supremacists is so bad.

[Brent]

Arguing with a die hard Trump supporter is like wrestling a pig in the mud. No matter how many times you pin it down, it thinks it's winning and actually enjoys wrestling in the mud.

[etucker1959]

Arguing with a die hard Trump supporter is like wrestling a pig in the mud. No matter how many times you pin it down, it thinks it's winning and actually enjoys wrestling in the mud.

What you say is true about a "True" Trump supporter and they will never change their mind. However, that's only 35% of the voters!!! He can't win re-election with that number. So our little discussions are for the other 25% swing voters. Who may have voted for Obama in 2008 and were disappointed. Who then voted for Trump in 2016 and should now be shaking in their boots!!!! Look folks, "NONE OF THESE PEOPLE ARE MIRACLE WORKERS!!!" So when you have a choice, like a "not so perfect Hillary" OR "A NUT JOB IN TRUMP" Just take the lessor of 2 EVILS!!!! I would vote for Kasich (who is a Republican) over some unknown Democrat (wouldn't know what your getting) if those were the choices!!!!

[Natural Lefty]

I have heard some pretty bad things about Kasich from people who live in Ohio, Eric. (He tows the conservative line on a lot of the same issues as Trump and Pence.) Anyway, by the time of the election, you should know a lot about both the Dem and Repub candidates. I do agree in principle with incrementalism and voting for the least bad choice. I don't like the term lessor or 2 evils though, because it frames politics very negatively. I prefer to think of the greater good. ;) By the way, polls show that Trump's base is dwindling even further. Thirty five percent may be an upper limit on it now, and it goes down from there.

I doubt any of us here are part of Antifa, so in a way, it's a moot point, except that implying that we are, or saying that the Democratic Party has embraced them, is false. We are against fascism, presumably, which doesn't have to include strong arm tactics. I don't know that much about Antifa, but to say that they are themselves fascistic seems dubious, since being fascist presumes being in power, and implies not being opposed to fascism. As for Black Lives Matter, I have not heard of them doing anything violent, but they were rude to Bernie Sanders during the campaign, which I found puzzling and perturbing. (Bernie Sanders was the one candidate who used to join in Civil Rights protests.) I don't think the Democratic Party particularly identifies with them, either.

We aren't communists, either. The correct term would be democratic socialists, which is totally different from being a communist.

[etucker1959]

You watch all news outlets and have quoted several of them which i've already pointed out as being mouthpieces for Democratic party. You and Darkshadow have oft quoted on CNN, ABC, Wash Post and they've all being caught putting forth false storylines to fit their agenda. The falsehoods are too numerous for me to cite here and others have done plenty to point that out. Read the Fake news story post started by Dark shadow for examples :-)

I'm getting a little tired of the Fake News comment by Trump and Fox News. So let me quote a credible source other then coming from a Liberal. Mitch McConell leader of the Congress (Republican True Red) say's most news reported by the News outlets is "NOT FAKE NEWS!!!!"

[Natural Lefty]

The only major news outlet that is fake news is Fox News.

[DarkShadow]

Mitch McConell leader of the Congress (Republican True Red) say's most news reported by the News outlets is "NOT FAKE NEWS!!!!"

Well, ole Mitchy is critical of Trump.

Which means that in Trump's mind, McConnell saying most news is not fake is....

FAKE NEWS!

[Natural Lefty]

Trump and McConnell are both phonies. LOL

Meanwhile, McConnell's approval rating is at 18% in his own state, and 19% overall. Trump's is all the way up at around 37%, but gradually and steadily dropping. Bernie Sanders continues to be the most popular politician in the United States, with a 54% approval rating.

[CHUCKY]

Trump and McConnell are both phonies. LOL

Meanwhile, McConnell's approval rating is at 18% in his own state, and 19% overall. Trump's is all the way up at around 37%, but gradually and steadily dropping. Bernie Sanders continues to be the most popular politician in the United States, with a 54% approval rating.

Are these the same poles the had trump losing? Lmfao. Let's go fishing already. Please have pictures of fish tho.

[Natural Lefty]

Trump did lose (the popular vote by over 2.8 million votes and 2 percentage points), but the Electoral College handed him the presidency, not to mention all the voter suppression of Kris Kobach's crosscheck program and GOP voter ID laws, preventing probably over a million people from voting, most of whom are minority people who would probably vote for Democrats. These people who were wrongly denied the right to vote, very well could have reversed even the Electoral College results. http://prospect.org/article/voter-suppression-mirror-and-looking-forward

Oh, I just did come back from fishing, but didn't take any pictures of the little fishy I caught.

[etucker1959]

Are these the same poles the had trump losing? Lmfao. Let's go fishing already. Please have pictures of fish tho.

I'm in the Market for a new camera. (old one crapped out) Our park catfish we caught yesterday at Guasti, were actually worthy of pictures. So look for some pictures in some of my future reports. However, I might have to pull a Wilson (Tool Time) and always keep my face covered. Some of the Conservatives on here aren't only misguided in their political beliefs. But also appear to be emotional unstable capable of doing who knows what?????

[CHUCKY]

I'm in the Market for a new camera. (old one crapped out) Our park catfish we caught yesterday at Guasti, were actually worthy of pictures. So look for some pictures in some of my future reports. However, I might have to pull a Wilson (Tool Time) and always keep my face covered. Some of the Conservatives on here aren't only misguided in their political beliefs. But also appear to be emotional unstable capable of doing who knows what?????

I always read your reports. They are good. Me and my dad used to fish guasti all the time when I was a kid. That's a cool little lake.

[steelhead]

More peaceful protest from the antifa group who purportedly was protesting "hate" with clubs and other weapons

https://www.yahoo.com/news/birthplace-free-speech-movement-braces-141605502.html

[CHUCKY]

More peaceful protest from the antifa group who purportedly was protesting "hate" with clubs and other weapons

https://www.yahoo.com/news/birthplace-free-speech-movement-braces-141605502.html

That's the problem with snowflakes. They are right you are wrong. kind of like ISIS. There is no reasoning with these people.

[etucker1959]

That's the problem with snowflakes. They are right you are wrong. kind of like ISIS. There is no reasoning with these people.

That's absolutely "NOT TRUE" about reasoning with people!!! First of all you had 2 totally separate groups. The anarchists and the peaceful protesters. Your lumping the 2 together "WHICH IS TOTALLY WRONG!!!" I myself totally condemn the anarchists and what they stand for!!! Once again your own statements shoots your arguments straight down the toilet!!!

[Natural Lefty]

Yes, I agree with Eric. As I said before, I don't think anyone here supports Antifa. We support peaceful protest though, which is totally different.

[DarkShadow]

Yes, I agree with Eric. As I said before, I don't think anyone here supports Antifa. We support peaceful protest though, which is totally different.

Well, for one, I do support punching Nazis.

I guess that's just me, tho.

But yes, there are other ways of embarrassing them too:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rs4P1kKK-5k

[etucker1959]

Well, for one, I do support punching Nazis.

I guess that's just me, tho.

But yes, there are other ways of embarrassing them too:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rs4P1kKK-5k

That would be a perfect video to put up, "If you know who" ever dared to show his face on here again!!! lol

[DarkShadow]

More peaceful protest from the antifa group who purportedly was protesting "hate" with clubs and other weapons

https://www.yahoo.com/news/birthplace-free-speech-movement-braces-141605502.html

Knives too! :

http://nypost.com/2017/08/19/man-stabbed-after-haircut-gets-him-mistaken-for-a-neo-nazi/

[Natural Lefty]

They probably do deserve to be punched, but I support putting Nazis in jail.

[steelhead]

They believe they have the higher moral ground and have all the answers and there's a few on here that try to point out the irony in my statements.

The irony is how the fake news media likes to lump all conservatives who support Trump in with the skinheads and nazis and label conservatives as racist but on the other hand they characterize the antifa and BLM terrorist as representative of the general public's disenfranchisement with Trump and therefore perfectly okay. Up to this point i've seen no public condemnation by fake news media unless it got so out of hand that they could not sweep it under the rug, i.e. Berkeley protest. If you read further into that story you will see much similar to Baltimore and Charlottesville the Berkeley police had their police to turn the other way while allowing these domestic terrorist to blend in with the other marchers which led to the assaults. This state is unfortunately being run into the ground by corrupt Jerry Brown and his democrat mafia but yet you've got leftist on here worried about skinheads and nazis! Talk about a red herring


That's the problem with snowflakes. They are right you are wrong. kind of like ISIS. There is no reasoning with these people.

[steelhead]

Hyper PC leftists pull "Gone with the Wind" from Memphis theater. Coming to a town near you, KFC Colonel Sanders to be replaced by Foghorn Leghorn among other images that can be perceived as racist by the lefty loons, next up burning of books with any reference to the confederate, southern life, slavery, civil war, etc. Congratulations we've come full circle A la George Orwell.

[etucker1959]

Hyper PC leftists pull "Gone with the Wind" from Memphis theater. Coming to a town near you, KFC Colonel Sanders to be replaced by Foghorn Leghorn among other images that can be perceived as racist by the lefty loons, next up burning of books with any reference to the confederate, southern life, slavery, civil war, etc. Congratulations we've come full circle A la George Orwell.

That is true that the Left try's to be too politically correct. In contrast the Republicans just don't give a xxxx about how anything looks or sounds!!! When former VP Dick Cheney was asked about how something would look??? He gave an answer that totally sums up the Republicans position. "SO!!!"But If I had to pick a group to support, I would pick the group that cares about peoples feelings or how something looks or sounds. Over the one that believes in winning at all cost!!! The Republicans will lie (look at Trump) Cheat (Voter ID Laws) or want to recruit any fringe group that will vote for them. (White Supremacists)

[etucker1959]

They believe they have the higher moral ground and have all the answers and there's a few on here that try to point out the irony in my statements.

The irony is how the fake news media likes to lump all conservatives who support Trump in with the skinheads and nazis and label conservatives as racist but on the other hand they characterize the antifa and BLM terrorist as representative of the general public's disenfranchisement with Trump and therefore perfectly okay. Up to this point i've seen no public condemnation by fake news media unless it got so out of hand that they could not sweep it under the rug, i.e. Berkeley protest. If you read further into that story you will see much similar to Baltimore and Charlottesville the Berkeley police had their police to turn the other way while allowing these domestic terrorist to blend in with the other marchers which led to the assaults. This state is unfortunately being run into the ground by corrupt Jerry Brown and his democrat mafia but yet you've got leftist on here worried about skinheads and nazis! Talk about a red herring

You say the state is being run into the ground by Jerry Brown. Would you like to have Arnold back???? Remember he gave us the MLPA'S and a "Huge" budget deficit!!! If someone like him continued and had to face that huge budget deficit. Imagine what things would be like in the State??? There would be Cuts to Education, Infrastructure and many Social programs. What do you think your fee's would be like at your favorite lake to fish, park and launch your boat???? You should get on your knees and "THANK" Governor Jerry Brown for righting the ship, after a Republican Governor almost sank the boat!!!!

[Stormcrow]

You say the state is being run into the ground by Jerry Brown. Would you like to have Arnold back???? Remember he gave us the MLPA'S and a "Huge" budget deficit!!! If someone like him continued and had to face that huge budget deficit. Imagine what things would be like in the State??? There would be Cuts to Education, Infrastructure and many Social programs. What do you think your fee's would be like at your favorite lake to fish, park and launch your boat???? You should get on your knees and "THANK" Governor Jerry Brown for righting the ship, after a Republican Governor almost sank the boat!!!!

LOL
you're just pathetic. Will you be thankful when gas taxes force prices into the 4 dollar a gallon range? I doubt it.

[etucker1959]

LOL
you're just pathetic. Will you be thankful when gas taxes force prices into the 4 dollar a gallon range? I doubt it.

I doubt we will ever see $4 a gallon gas based on the gasoline tax. Gasoline is going to be the Dinosaur of fuel in the years to come. Which should make oil even cheaper!!! Look what India is doing with electric cars!!! (we should try to model that!!!) Buy into the gasoline only car theory and cry me a river of tears with your gasoline bill. I already switched and watched my gasoline bill go from $400 a month to $150.

[steelhead]

You need a picture i.d. to cash your checks at the bank without an account, you need it to get onto a plane to buy cigarettes and liquor if you look under 35 and you need it to get into the Indian casinos but you're telling me these democrat voters don't have an i.d.? to go to the voting booth? Nice try, if you wanted to vote 5 times in different cities here in California under different names you could have this past election because there is no voter i.d. requirement. There is no way for them to tell because they do not crosscheck it against other cities/counties. Also when these illegals register for their driver's license there is a box they can check that allows them to register to vote and voila! An absentee ballot is sent home and guess what they don't even have to show up at the polls so tell me who is going around verifying that the absentee ballots are from legal citizens? I can assure you not Jerry Brown and the democrat mafia in California. There you have it liberals, there's your popular vote difference, millions in California alone.
Prior to the last election the liberal talking point was there has only been a few isolated cases of voter fraud, a crock of @#$#. . Maybe you're of the vote early vote often crowd?


That is true that the Left try's to be too politically correct. In contrast the Republicans just don't give a xxxx about how anything looks or sounds!!! When former VP Dick Cheney was asked about how something would look??? He gave an answer that totally sums up the Republicans position. "SO!!!"But If I had to pick a group to support, I would pick the group that cares about peoples feelings or how something looks or sounds. Over the one that believes in winning at all cost!!! The Republicans will lie (look at Trump) Cheat (Voter ID Laws) or want to recruit any fringe group that will vote for them. (White Supremacists)

[CHUCKY]

You say the state is being run into the ground by Jerry Brown. Would you like to have Arnold back???? Remember he gave us the MLPA'S and a "Huge" budget deficit!!! If someone like him continued and had to face that huge budget deficit. Imagine what things would be like in the State??? There would be Cuts to Education, Infrastructure and many Social programs. What do you think your fee's would be like at your favorite lake to fish, park and launch your boat???? You should get on your knees and "THANK" Governor Jerry Brown for righting the ship, after a Republican Governor almost sank the boat!!!!

Thank you jerry brown for higher taxes, failing infrastructure and the train to no where. Really doing a stand out job.

[steelhead]

You must be one of those "dreamers" that likes to pretend the past never happened and if you click your heels 3 times you can magically traverse the yellow brick road which ends in Berkeley where the Wizard is Jerry Brown himself. Gasoline has gone as high as $3.50 and beyond a few times in this state and you don't think it's going to ever hit $4.00. What makes you think they're not going to jack up the price again after they finish with raising it this time. By the way did you have a way in whether it was imposed or not? NOOO because they rammed it through with a 2/3 majority without a public vote and now using mafia tactics to stop a recall effort. That is so transparent and American right? You point out Arnold's shortcomings, nothing Arnold held a candle to the corruption and dirty tactics being pulled off now.
Also with the price of EV beyond most government subsidized citizens reach how are they going to pay for that Volt? Are you going to subsidize for it? I love how liberals think they have a good use for someone else's money.



I doubt we will ever see $4 a gallon gas based on the gasoline tax. Gasoline is going to be the Dinosaur of fuel in the years to come. Which should make oil even cheaper!!! Look what India is doing with electric cars!!! (we should try to model that!!!) Buy into the gasoline only car theory and cry me a river of tears with your gasoline bill. I already switched and watched my gasoline bill go from $400 a month to $150.

[Natural Lefty]

It amazes me how conservatives believe liars over honest people (or deluded people over people who actually understand the truth and base their judgments on science, logic and evidence). I guess you can't stop people from believing the nonsense that they insist on believing. It's called motivated cognition.

How is it that all these people are supposedly committing voter fraud, Steelhead? What a crock of nonsense. They have our names, addresses, signatures, etc. at the place where we vote. These can easily be verified. Meanwhile, voter ID laws are just one aspect of a larger strategy of system rigging by the GOP, including the Crosscheck program to eliminate inconvenient voters, gerrymandering, and getting two senators from less populous states, with far fewer votes than it takes to get two senators from California, plus they have the electoral college working in their favor so they don't even have to win the popular presidential vote to get their person in office if the vote is close enough. And I could go on from there. Republicans have not won an honest presidency since Eisenhower, and they cheat at every other level nowadays too. They will do practically anything to get and hold onto power, including letting a narcissistic, racist, sexist, deluded, completely unqualified you-know-what grabber in chief who never should have been allowed to come anywhere near the presidency like Trump lead them.

[Natural Lefty]

By the way, Chucky, how are we supposed to improve our infrastructure with lower taxes?

Not enough taxes is the reason our infrastructure around the nation has been deteriorating.

[etucker1959]

You need a picture i.d. to cash your checks at the bank without an account, you need it to get onto a plane to buy cigarettes and liquor if you look under 35 and you need it to get into the Indian casinos but you're telling me these democrat voters don't have an i.d.? to go to the voting booth? Nice try, if you wanted to vote 5 times in different cities here in California under different names you could have this past election because there is no voter i.d. requirement. There is no way for them to tell because they do not crosscheck it against other cities/counties. Also when these illegals register for their driver's license there is a box they can check that allows them to register to vote and voila! An absentee ballot is sent home and guess what they don't even have to show up at the polls so tell me who is going around verifying that the absentee ballots are from legal citizens? I can assure you not Jerry Brown and the democrat mafia in California. There you have it liberals, there's your popular vote difference, millions in California alone.
Prior to the last election the liberal talking point was there has only been a few isolated cases of voter fraud, a crock of @#$#. . Maybe you're of the vote early vote often crowd?

Voter ID Laws is my specialty!!!! lol Your arguments sounded reasonable 5 years ago before the data and the true confessions and court cases came out. First of all there was a Great study done right here in California done at the University of San Diego and it went back 15 years and counted 1 Billion votes cast. Of the 1 Billion votes cast, they only found 33 cases of in person voter fraud. (In other words, it's a problem that doesn't exist) Do you buy Zombie Apocalypse Insurance??? Probably not because it's a problem that doesn't exist!!! (according to the TV commercials certain Insurance company's do cover Zombie Apocalypse) I'll bet you those same people support Voter ID Laws??? lol What they did find was the States were using Voter ID laws to target minority voters and keep them from voting. In North Carolina for example, (the people took those Bastards to court) the court found out they went after the African American voter with precision accuracy in trying to prevent them from voting. (the Republicans felt African Americans voted for the Democrats far to often) The court ruled, that the Republicans resorted to cheating to win elections.

Now let me give you "your same argument back" you used on statues here and then apply the same logic to Voter ID laws. You said, they will come down and take the Confederate statues down first and then go after the statues of Washington and Jefferson. Ok the Republicans used Voter ID laws to eliminate as many Democrats as they can for voting. Now the Super Elite 1% ers say eliminating Democrats from voting isn't enough. They now want to eliminate all but themselves from voting. Remember there is a bunch of White Welfare queens too that live in Rural America. They may want to eliminate them from voting too!!! I easily could make that argument too and it would sound just as reasonable as your Voter ID law argument. Mitt Romey said in the 2012 Presidential election for example (Republican candidate of course) that 47% of the population doesn't pay any Federal Tax's. (So they don't have any skin in the game do they??) That would be the next logical group to go after and eliminate them from voting too!!! Don't think you got any Constitutional protection on your right to vote!!! (sorry you don't) After what the Supreme Court ruled in 2010 to the voting rights act, they can change the voting rules any way they want!!! In fact the founding fathers didn't want riff raff like you to vote!!! (I bet you didn't know that???) So be careful what you wish for!!! You might actually get it and then it turns around and bites you in the Hinney and takes away your right to vote!!!!!! I'll bet you didn't see that coming!!!!!

In Addressing your last line of a crock of poo poo!!! (based on the last election) The President set up that commission, headed up by that Nut job to work on the alleged fraudulent voting that took place in the last election. Did you see the response the States gave him in his request for voter information??? It typical was one of 3 responses. Response number 1. We will get back to you on that one. (NOT!!!!) Response number 2. We will only give you information that is already Public Information. Last but not least response number 3. (this one was my favorite) Go Pluck yourself!!!!!!!!

[etucker1959]

You must be one of those "dreamers" that likes to pretend the past never happened and if you click your heels 3 times you can magically traverse the yellow brick road which ends in Berkeley where the Wizard is Jerry Brown himself. Gasoline has gone as high as $3.50 and beyond a few times in this state and you don't think it's going to ever hit $4.00. What makes you think they're not going to jack up the price again after they finish with raising it this time. By the way did you have a way in whether it was imposed or not? NOOO because they rammed it through with a 2/3 majority without a public vote and now using mafia tactics to stop a recall effort. That is so transparent and American right? You point out Arnold's shortcomings, nothing Arnold held a candle to the corruption and dirty tactics being pulled off now.
Also with the price of EV beyond most government subsidized citizens reach how are they going to pay for that Volt? Are you going to subsidize for it? I love how liberals think they have a good use for someone else's money.

I actually have a Volt, so what do you want to know??? Other then how great it is!!!!!

[steelhead]

Your big assumption is that all those who don't have I.D. are democrats. I'm for I.D. laws for all Americans in order to vote and I mean legal Americans, not the ones that are here illegally or undocumented. Yes I'm even for those that vote Republican to have I.D. What makes you think that this is an effort to suppress the democrat vote? I thought according to your fake news media the Trump supporters are the poor whites from midwest states that actually would suffer under Trump's policies? Wouldn't that go against this ridiculous argument of yours that voter I.D. is to suppress democrat voters who are too poor to go through the process of acquiring an I.D? Contradicting fake news is it not? This thing about having data and cross referencing to make sure you are who you are? That is if you've lived here and filed taxes with the IRS but how many are here without papers. Tens upon millions MORE than the 11 million liberal press puts out there in other words it is in the tens of millions! So don't tell me they're checking to see if some illegal living in Los Angeles County is the same one that voted in Sacramento California. There is no mass effort to assure voting integrity.



Voter ID Laws is my specialty!!!! lol Your arguments sounded reasonable 5 years ago before the data and the true confessions and court cases came out. First of all there was a Great study done right here in California done at the University of San Diego and it went back 15 years and counted 1 Billion votes cast. Of the 1 Billion votes cast, they only found 33 cases of in person voter fraud. (In other words, it's a problem that doesn't exist) Do you buy Zombie Apocalypse Insurance??? Probably not because it's a problem that doesn't exist!!! (according to the TV commercials certain Insurance company's do cover Zombie Apocalypse) I'll bet you those same people support Voter ID Laws??? lol What they did find was the States were using Voter ID laws to target minority voters and keep them from voting. In North Carolina for example, (the people took those Bastards to court) the court found out they went after the African American voter with precision accuracy in trying to prevent them from voting. (the Republicans felt African Americans voted for the Democrats far to often) The court ruled, that the Republicans resorted to cheating to win elections.

Now let me give you "your same argument back" you used on statues here and then apply the same logic to Voter ID laws. You said, they will come down and take the Confederate statues down first and then go after the statues of Washington and Jefferson. Ok the Republicans used Voter ID laws to eliminate as many Democrats as they can for voting. Now the Super Elite 1% ers say eliminating Democrats from voting isn't enough. They now want to eliminate all but themselves from voting. Remember there is a bunch of White Welfare queens too that live in Rural America. They may want to eliminate them from voting too!!! I easily could make that argument too and it would sound just as reasonable as your Voter ID law argument. Mitt Romey said in the 2012 Presidential election for example (Republican candidate of course) that 47% of the population doesn't pay any Federal Tax's. (So they don't have any skin in the game do they??) That would be the next logical group to go after and eliminate them from voting too!!! Don't think you got any Constitutional protection on your right to vote!!! (sorry you don't) After what the Supreme Court ruled in 2010 to the voting rights act, they can change the voting rules any way they want!!! In fact the founding fathers didn't want riff raff like you to vote!!! (I bet you didn't know that???) So be careful what you wish for!!! You might actually get it and then it turns around and bites you in the Hinney and takes away your right to vote!!!!!! I'll bet you didn't see that coming!!!!!

In Addressing your last line of a crock of poo poo!!! (based on the last election) The President set up that commission, headed up by that Nut job to work on the alleged fraudulent voting that took place in the last election. Did you see the response the States gave him in his request for voter information??? It typical was one of 3 responses. Response number 1. We will get back to you on that one. (NOT!!!!) Response number 2. We will only give you information that is already Public Information. Last but not least response number 3. (this one was my favorite) Go Pluck yourself!!!!!!!!

[steelhead]

Yes because increasing taxes is the solution to all of our problems, so how is it thtago other states with NO gas tax and the roads are in much better shape? As an example Oregon. Take the 5 up north and once you cross the border notice how the cracks and bumps disappear and yes that state is as liberal as California. So can you say poor leadership, mismanagement of the taxes they collect and lining their own pockets? You bet! You libs got an excuse for everything and when in doubt raise taxes some more!

[Natural Lefty]

Actually, they do have gas taxes in Oregon, at least in Portland. Here is an accounting of where their road maintenance money comes from and goes to. https://www.portlandoregon.gov/transportation/article/441782

Let's talk about how great our cars are, Eric. ;) I have a Toyota Prius C, and you have a Chevy Volt. My wife suggested getting one of those "water cars" (a Toyota Mirai) next. What do you think?

I have heard all the same things about the rarity of voter fraud, by the way. For every double voter, there are a large number of legitimate would be voters who are turned away. In fact, even though it wasn't crowded when we voted last November, a man came in to vote but wasn't allowed to at my polling station. I think they said that he wasn't on their list. And this of course was in California (Moreno Valley).

[etucker1959]

Your big assumption is that all those who don't have I.D. are democrats. I'm for I.D. laws for all Americans in order to vote and I mean legal Americans, not the ones that are here illegally or undocumented. Yes I'm even for those that vote Republican to have I.D. What makes you think that this is an effort to suppress the democrat vote? I thought according to your fake news media the Trump supporters are the poor whites from midwest states that actually would suffer under Trump's policies? Wouldn't that go against this ridiculous argument of yours that voter I.D. is to suppress democrat voters who are too poor to go through the process of acquiring an I.D? Contradicting fake news is it not? This thing about having data and cross referencing to make sure you are who you are? That is if you've lived here and filed taxes with the IRS but how many are here without papers. Tens upon millions MORE than the 11 million liberal press puts out there in other words it is in the tens of millions! So don't tell me they're checking to see if some illegal living in Los Angeles County is the same one that voted in Sacramento California. There is no mass effort to assure voting integrity.

Obviously you don't know your History of Jim Crow laws, that were solely intended to suppress the Black vote. The Voter ID laws are merely the latest version of Jim Crow ideas. I would explain the 3 most common Jim Crow ideas on how to suppress the Negro vote. But poor Seal up in the mountains, might get an Arianism over reading one of my long winded speeches. (Seal, I worry about you Health since your close to my age) lol So if your curious, Google (Poll tax, White primary and the Literacy test for voters.)


Sorry Seal, after looking at my examples, the Literacy test is worth explaining because it's not what it seems. You would think it was to prove you were literate to be able to vote. It wasn't, it was more diabolic then that. It was a test given on the spot in the polling place. It was an oral test designed to pass all White voters and Fail all would be Negro voters. It would go something like this, a White voter would show up and be asked to explain what, "We the people mean as written in the Constitution??" It didn't matter what the White voter said, "he would have been deemed to have satisfied the person giving the test." Now a potential Black voter shows up and is asked to explain, what is meant in the Constitution that there will be no Bills of attainder passed by Congress? Even if the would be Black voter was a Harvard Law school Graduate, his answer would never pass the examiners test!! He would be failed on any answer he would give!!!! (If Seal gives me permission, I will explain to everyone what a Bill of Attainder is??) lol

Another way to suppress the vote without Voter ID laws, but is just as effective is doing some of the following. Reduce the amount of polling places. (Arizona was famous for this one) By reducing the amount of polling places from say 80 to 20, you make people travel longer distances to get to a polling station. Then because there is now only 20 places to vote, the lines of people waiting to vote could be horrendous. (People in some cases waited for hours just to vote.) Now take an elderly minority person who might even have a valid ID to vote but has no transportation to get to a polling place. You just cancelled out her or his vote. Or if she could make it, now she has to stand in line for hours just to vote and she's 88 years old!!! Can I now send you a Brown Paper bag to put over your head for your attitude for our Senior Citizens and their right to vote!!!! Another quick example, (I know Seals reading this, so I have to make it real quick) lol Another suppression trick was ending the Souls to the Polls which was very common in the South. In a Nut Shell, people would go to Church on Sunday morning then a whole van of people would all head to the polls afterwards and vote. Easy Republican solution to suppress the vote on that one. "NO VOTING IS ALLOWED ON SUNDAY!!!" Yea, I could keep going on but I think you should get the point by now!!!!!!

Even with all this cheating the Republicans are doing to win elections. What are they accomplishing???? I'll just quote John McCain on this one, "We are accomplishing absolutely Nothing!!!"

[Natural Lefty]

Reduction in polling places in urban areas is another voter suppression tactic which has become more common since Jim Crow laws were ended. I had forgotten about that one. Thank you for mentioning it, Eric.

Since the SCOTUS knocked down parts of the Voting Rights Act a couple of years ago, there has been a sudden reduction in polling places in "southern," Republican controlled states. Arizona also had too few polling stations in the urban, Phoenix area, and Trump narrowly won that state. The study in this article only analyzed certain counties, by the way, so the actual reduction in polling places was probably far more than 868. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/11/4/13501120/vote-polling-places-election-2016

[etucker1959]

Actually, they do have gas taxes in Oregon, at least in Portland. Here is an accounting of where their road maintenance money comes from and goes to. https://www.portlandoregon.gov/transportation/article/441782

Let's talk about how great our cars are, Eric. ;) I have a Toyota Prius C, and you have a Chevy Volt. My wife suggested getting one of those "water cars" (a Toyota Mirai) next. What do you think?

I have heard all the same things about the rarity of voter fraud, by the way. For every double voter, there are a large number of legitimate would be voters who are turned away. In fact, even though it wasn't crowded when we voted last November, a man came in to vote but wasn't allowed to at my polling station. I think they said that he wasn't on their list. And this of course was in California (Moreno Valley).

I'm not familiar with the Toyota Mirai, what is it's distinguishing characteristics?

[Natural Lefty]

It's a hydrogen fuel cell car, Eric. Apparently, it is easier and quicker to "refuel" hydrogen cell cars than to charge electric cars. California government is planning to have a large series of hydrogen cell stations across California.

Basically, water is separated into hydrogen gas and oxygen. The fuel cell contains the hydrogen gas (totally harmless). When the car is being driven, hydrogen reunites with oxygen in the atmosphere and makes water (also harmless) and in the process, releases energy which is used to drive the car.

Solar energy or other clean sources can be used to create the hydrogen gas from water, for the fuel cells, so potentially, a person or family with solar panels could just fill their hydrogen fuel cells at home using their own home energy supply. I am hopeful that this is the way of the future (which Mirai means in Japanese), or else it could be electric cars recharged by solar, wind, etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Mirai

[DarkShadow]

Voter Fraud?

Our President has a special counsel investigating this.

Obviously, since it's such a big issue, I'm sure the special counsel will find discrepancies.

I'll be posting follow ups as they come in, in regards to this huge voter fraud issue.

In the meantime, check out the Fake News:

https://www.google.com/search?q=voter+fraud+trump&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

[Natural Lefty]

A check shows that the Mirai costs about $45 thousand dollars, but hopefully the price will go down. It also costs an estimated $1,250 per year for the fuel cells.

[Natural Lefty]

Did I mention my Kris Kobach dream? He is the guy who is in charge of Crosscheck and supposedly catching voter fraud (for the actual purpose of engaging in voter suppression).

Several months ago, I dreamed that my wife and I went to Kobach Lake, and caught Kobach fish by the dam(n?). Those vermin Kobach fish need to be gotten rid of. ;)

[etucker1959]

It's a hydrogen fuel cell car, Eric. Apparently, it is easier and quicker to "refuel" hydrogen cell cars than to charge electric cars. California government is planning to have a large series of hydrogen cell stations across California.

Basically, water is separated into hydrogen gas and oxygen. The fuel cell contains the hydrogen gas (totally harmless). When the car is being driven, hydrogen reunites with oxygen in the atmosphere and makes water (also harmless) and in the process, releases energy which is used to drive the car.

Solar energy or other clean sources can be used to create the hydrogen gas from water, for the fuel cells, so potentially, a person or family with solar panels could just fill their hydrogen fuel cells at home using their own home energy supply. I am hopeful that this is the way of the future (which Mirai means in Japanese), or else it could be electric cars recharged by solar, wind, etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Mirai

I'm familiar with the technology of hydrogen fuel cell cars, I didn't know the name of the Toyota version. It's funny about the hydrogen fuel cell cars. I first heard about them 15 years ago and they thought that might be the long term solution/alternative to the gasoline powered automobiles. They thought back then the technology was 30 plus years away. They cut that number in half!! It's amazing what Mankind can do if faced with a real need. (A non polluting vehicle is just what the planet needs!!!)

[steelhead]

There is no state gas tax, if your Moreno Valley decided to tax within city limits does that equate to a state tax? It doesn't add anything to the argument as the roads in Oregon OUTSIDE of Portland city limits are still vastly superior to California roads. They also believe in a democratic process up there where it was a VOTER APPROVED tax hike rather than our communist emperor and his generals forcing through a tax hike without voter input? How about you address that Lefty? You must be so far left you're not even on the political spectrum. The Guvnor and his goon squad is forcing through a gas tax without any voter input by way of a 2/3 majority and how they are rewriting the laws to prevent a public recall in an attempt to maintain that 2/3 and ram through any law they want. We're several steps closer to a communist CA state.





Actually, they do have gas taxes in Oregon, at least in Portland. Here is an accounting of where their road maintenance money comes from and goes to. https://www.portlandoregon.gov/transportation/article/441782

Let's talk about how great our cars are, Eric. ;) I have a Toyota Prius C, and you have a Chevy Volt. My wife suggested getting one of those "water cars" (a Toyota Mirai) next. What do you think?

I have heard all the same things about the rarity of voter fraud, by the way. For every double voter, there are a large number of legitimate would be voters who are turned away. In fact, even though it wasn't crowded when we voted last November, a man came in to vote but wasn't allowed to at my polling station. I think they said that he wasn't on their list. And this of course was in California (Moreno Valley).

[steelhead]

I don't know ONE person who has had the government contact them to verify if they voted. I've voted in dozens of elections and i know more than a few people and i've not heard of anyone even second hand ever being contacted from the voters registrar to confirm a ballot. Now I will admit I'm in California.

Honest people hmmm, you are the part of the blind sheeple that have too much faith in our media. At no time in the history of this country has the media had such a big impact on shaping peoples perception, unfortunately it is all propagandize and bias.

What happened to the recount effort in Detroit MI hmm? Results tallied that counted double the number of actual ballots, so rampant that they had to shut down the recount the effort for fear of the fraud being discovered. Had there been no recount those numbers would have stood, what if it had came down to Michigan and that district being the deciding factor?






It amazes me how conservatives believe liars over honest people (or deluded people over people who actually understand the truth and base their judgments on science, logic and evidence). I guess you can't stop people from believing the nonsense that they insist on believing. It's called motivated cognition.

How is it that all these people are supposedly committing voter fraud, Steelhead? What a crock of nonsense. They have our names, addresses, signatures, etc. at the place where we vote. These can easily be verified. Meanwhile, voter ID laws are just one aspect of a larger strategy of system rigging by the GOP, including the Crosscheck program to eliminate inconvenient voters, gerrymandering, and getting two senators from less populous states, with far fewer votes than it takes to get two senators from California, plus they have the electoral college working in their favor so they don't even have to win the popular presidential vote to get their person in office if the vote is close enough. And I could go on from there. Republicans have not won an honest presidency since Eisenhower, and they cheat at every other level nowadays too. They will do practically anything to get and hold onto power, including letting a narcissistic, racist, sexist, deluded, completely unqualified you-know-what grabber in chief who never should have been allowed to come anywhere near the presidency like Trump lead them.

[Natural Lefty]

A. I am not a radical. In fact, I have taken tests of political orientation twice, and I am placed about halfway between the center of the circle and the left side both times, in liberal territory but not far left. I know lots of people who are more extreme left than me. In fact, my friends and I were called things like "Clinton apologists" by a lot of Bernie or Busters even though that isn't true. We are just realists. This leads me to believe that you are so far right that anything on the left side of the spectrum looks radical to you, Steelhead.

B. The whole thing about Oregon roads, I find a strange argument., especially since Oregon is also a liberal state. Do you think that roads in Oregon fix themselves? Obviously not. Whether the maintenance if funded locally or statewide, it is funded. I tried to look up states with the best and worst roads, and neither CA nor OR were on either extreme, actually. I could not find their exact rankings though. I was responding previously as though your claims about Oregon are true, but frankly, I haven't noticed much of a difference in road condition. To the extent that there is, remember, CA has the largest population, the most cars, and a large area to take care of. All of these factors make it more difficult to maintain roads well.

C. Again, there is a huge difference between democracy and communism. I think you live in CA so if you think it's a horrible commie place, I have to wonder why you stay here. Of course it is not a horrible commie place. CA has a Democratic supermajority now because they were voted in by voters. It would be nice to have a proposition to fund something like road maintenance, I agree. (I am a big supporter of voter-initiated propositions.). My guess is that it would pass. But our state representatives have been doing our bidding. They are not acting like dictators. You just call them that because you don't agree with their policies.

[Natural Lefty]

In regards to the claims of massive voter fraud in Detroit, virtually every source that has studied voter fraud says that is untrue, nor is it election fraud. The turnout in Detroit wasn't particularly high. How could the official count have been twice what it really was. Did Obama import a bunch of Kenyans by submarine just to vote in Detroit, then send them back to Kenya? LOL

About the only site that I could find making claims of voter frauhttps://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-gateway-pundit/d in Michigan was the Gateway Pundit, which is rated as having an extreme right wing bias and some of its articles are fake news.