Mr. President

[MikesOcean]

http://i1289.photobucket.com/albums/b516/mikesocean/Mobile%20Uploads/543C7A92-22CB-43F7-873B-7479A5BC7D0B.png_zpsr0cktlkz.jpeg (http://s1289.photobucket.com/user/mikesocean/media/Mobile%20Uploads/543C7A92-22CB-43F7-873B-7479A5BC7D0B.png_zpsr0cktlkz.jpeg.html)

Like all the other Presidents he promised he would acknowledge this if they were elected and did not follow
Through.

Very disappointing! My grandmothers brothers and Father were all beheaded.

We were hopeful because it was a 100 years. We really felt he would have done what was right like many
Other countries in the world. He knows it was a Genocide. But I know, I know, he's worried he doesn't want to offend Turkey and ruin our entrance into the Middle East. Blah Blah Blah

Carry on Mr. President with your ObamaDontCare!

[Lady Quagga]

A formal recognition of the Armenian Genocide by the U.S. government as a whole is long overdue. Geopolitical considerations with Turkey be damned.


Carry on Mr. President with your ObamaDontCare!

Why diminish such an important issue with this comment?

[MikesOcean]

A formal recognition of the Armenian Genocide by the U.S. government as a whole is long overdue. Geopolitical considerations with Turkey be damned.

Thank you for that!



Why diminish such an important issue with this comment?

We thought he cared!

[TROUT MASTERS]

I swear by the spilled blood of my ancestors me and 10 million + Armenians will never forget or forgive 1915 Armenina Genocide !
As far as "president" his has no balls,looks whats going on with US and our foreign policy.
Long leave our Christian Nation!!

[etucker1959]

Question to the audience. Are we satisfied with our government and the Presidents with our own AMERICAN Genocide????? For the very slow ones (what the white man did to the Native Americans) There was no excuse for all the relocations we did to the native people. We are just as guilty for our own Baton Death March in the trail of tears.

So I don't get accused of thread jacking, let me address the Armenian Genocide. It was 1915 WW1 has broken out, with the Russian to the North on the Allies side. The Turks to the South on the Axis side and the Armenians right in the middle. The Turks claim the Armenians were just part of the terrible causalities WW1 inflicted on everyone. The Armenians claim the Turks were always jealous of the Armenians and now they had their excuse to do ethnic cleansing on the Armenians. So there you have it!!! I just wanted to make sure everyone knew the story, so you can know understand what the debate is all about!!!!

[City Dad]

A formal recognition of the Armenian Genocide by the U.S. government as a whole is long overdue. Geopolitical considerations with Turkey be damned.

and the Sudanese genocide, and the Guatemalan and the Rawandan, etc., etc., etc.. We, as a nation, seem to have a predilection for viewing atrocities in a context of convenience.

[DEVOREFLYER]

Question to the audience. Are we satisfied with our Democratic government and the Democratic Presidents with our own AMERICAN Genocide????? For the very slow ones (what the white man did to the Native Americans) There was no excuse for all the relocations we did to the native people. We are just as guilty for our own Baton Death March in the trail of tears.

So I don't get accused of thread jacking, let me address the Armenian Genocide. It was 1915 WW1 has broken out, with the Russian to the North on the Allies side. The Turks to the South on the Axis side and the Armenians right in the middle. The Turks claim the Armenians were just part of the terrible causalities WW1 inflicted on everyone. The Armenians claim the Turks were always jealous of the Armenians and now they had their excuse to do ethnic cleansing on the Armenians. So there you have it!!! I just wanted to make sure everyone knew the story, so you can know understand what the debate is all about!!!!

I fixed it for ya etucker and ya might want to read the following with regard to the "Indian Removal Act" which my Native American relatives lived through:

Gold had been discovered in Georgia in 1828, resulting in a Democrat-controlled Congress rushing through the Indian Removal Act, which passed by a single vote in 1830. It was signed by Democrat president Andrew Jackson and carried out by Democrat president Martin Van Buren.

Condemning the federal government’s mandate were members of the National Republican and Whig Parties, including Congressman Abraham Lincoln (IL); Senator Theodore Frelinghuysen (NJ), Senator Daniel Webster (MA); and Senator Henry Clay (KY). Tennessee Congressmen Davy Crockett gave an impassioned speech in defense of the Indians.

Missionaries Samuel Worcester and Elizur Butler were arrested for their opposition to Indian removal and their case went to the U.S. Supreme Court. Chief Justice John Marshall ruled in favor of the Cherokee in Worcester v. Georgia (1832), writing that the Cherokee Nation was a “distinct community” with self-government “in which the laws of Georgia can have no force.”

Justice Joseph Story wrote March 4, 1832: “Thanks be to God, the Court can wash their hands clean of the iniquity of oppressing the Indians and disregarding their rights.”

Noting that the Supreme Court had no power to enforce its edicts, but had to rely on the president to actually implement them, Democrat President Jackson was attributed with saying: “John Marshall has made his decision; now let him enforce it!”

General John E. Wool had sympathy for the Indians and hesitated carrying out the inhumane removal, resulting in Democrat President Martin Van Buren replacing him with General Winfield Scott.

Oh and I wonder what party was in power when the Japanese were interned during WWII.

[etucker1959]

I fixed it for ya etucker and ya might want to read the following with regard to the "Indian Removal Act" which my Native American relatives lived through:

Gold had been discovered in Georgia in 1828, resulting in a Democrat-controlled Congress rushing through the Indian Removal Act, which passed by a single vote in 1830. It was signed by Democrat president Andrew Jackson and carried out by Democrat president Martin Van Buren.

Condemning the federal government’s mandate were members of the National Republican and Whig Parties, including Congressman Abraham Lincoln (IL); Senator Theodore Frelinghuysen (NJ), Senator Daniel Webster (MA); and Senator Henry Clay (KY). Tennessee Congressmen Davy Crockett gave an impassioned speech in defense of the Indians.

Missionaries Samuel Worcester and Elizur Butler were arrested for their opposition to Indian removal and their case went to the U.S. Supreme Court. Chief Justice John Marshall ruled in favor of the Cherokee in Worcester v. Georgia (1832), writing that the Cherokee Nation was a “distinct community” with self-government “in which the laws of Georgia can have no force.”

Justice Joseph Story wrote March 4, 1832: “Thanks be to God, the Court can wash their hands clean of the iniquity of oppressing the Indians and disregarding their rights.”

Noting that the Supreme Court had no power to enforce its edicts, but had to rely on the president to actually implement them, Democrat President Jackson was attributed with saying: “John Marshall has made his decision; now let him enforce it!”

General John E. Wool had sympathy for the Indians and hesitated carrying out the inhumane removal, resulting in Democrat President Martin Van Buren replacing him with General Winfield Scott.

Oh and I wonder what party was in power when the Japanese were interned during WWII.
Hey Remember, I claimed to be a Republican up until 2000!!!!! Go Lincoln!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[seal]

Hey Remember, I claimed to be a Republican up until 2000!!!!! Go Lincoln!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Was that the same time the brain damage occurred? I'm concerned etucker.

[Lady Quagga]

and the Sudanese genocide, and the Guatemalan and the Rawandan, etc., etc., etc.. We, as a nation, seem to have a predilection for viewing atrocities in a context of convenience.

Amen. And I'd be willing to go so far as to replace the word "viewing" in your statement with "justifying", in certain circumstances.

I can see some ham-handed attempts to veer this thread into tangential and/or partisan discussion. Normally I'd be game. But in this case, I think it important to stay focused, and return to the topic at hand - formal recognition of the Armenian Genocide.

[DarkShadow]

I can see some ham-handed attempts to veer this thread into tangential and/or partisan discussion.

You mean some half assed history lesson that attempts to place the entire blame of the systematic extermination of a native group of a particular area squarely on the shoulders of a particular political party? That would never happen.

•

Anyhow, back on topic, I think Serj from SOAD said it best:

“Part of it is bringing attention to the fact that genocides are still happening, whether you use the word ‘genocide,’ ‘holocaust,’ or ‘humanitarian catastrophe. None of that is changing. We want to be part of that change. We want the recognition of the first genocide of the 20th century to be a renewal of confidence that humanity can stop killing itself.”

I hear they rocked Armenia for the 100 year remembrance:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtI6UxcCPsA

If anybody has seen them in concert, they can sure tear it up.

[etucker1959]

Was that the same time the brain damage occurred? I'm concerned etucker.
Hey Seal, that's pretty funny!!!!! However, Is there any Conservatives on this board who want to own up and say,"they liked George W. Bush as President??????"

[DEVOREFLYER]

YES, YES, YES it was Genocide of the Armenians and to ignore it or call it anything less for PC reasons is gutless!

Genocide
[jen-uh-sahyd]
noun
1.
the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.

Generally speaking, genocide does not necessarily mean the immediate destruction of a nation, except when accomplished by mass killings of all members of a nation. It is intended rather to signify a coordinated plan of different actions aimed at the destruction of essential foundations of the life of national groups, with the aim of annihilating the groups themselves. [Lemkin]

[DarkShadow]

YES, YES, YES it was Genocide of the Armenians and to ignore it or call it anything less for PC reasons is gutless!

Thank you Devore. Your last message in bold capital letters definitely makes up for your previous message (http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?83853-Mr-President&p=762947#post762947) where you tried to steer the conversation off course and tried to use an atrocity as your own campaigning grounds.

Good man!

[DEVOREFLYER]

No asshat, etucker drifted the thread on his agenda and I had to straighten him out on the real truth. Not unlike MO losing ancestors, I too lost ancestors and wished to set the record straight on who was responsible.

[DarkShadow]

I too lost ancestors and wished to set the record straight on who was responsible.

Ahh, so we can count on your support for a culture who was already here, gets outed by another culture who migrated to the land. Or when the xenophobes on the site begin to find their REPLY button.

OH wait a minute, you're one of those xenophobes yourself:

http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?83809-Advertisements-in-Spanish

(http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?83809-Advertisements-in-Spanish)Confused much?

[DEVOREFLYER]

Hard time stayin' on topic much eh!!!

[DarkShadow]

Hard time stayin' on topic much eh!!!

Says the person who wrote this in regards to the Armenian Genocide, then blamed someone else for steering them off topic (thanks Etucker):


I fixed it for ya etucker and ya might want to read the following with regard to the "Indian Removal Act" which my Native American relatives lived through:

Gold had been discovered in Georgia in 1828, resulting in a Democrat-controlled Congress rushing through the Indian Removal Act, which passed by a single vote in 1830. It was signed by Democrat president Andrew Jackson and carried out by Democrat president Martin Van Buren.

Condemning the federal government’s mandate were members of the National Republican and Whig Parties, including Congressman Abraham Lincoln (IL); Senator Theodore Frelinghuysen (NJ), Senator Daniel Webster (MA); and Senator Henry Clay (KY). Tennessee Congressmen Davy Crockett gave an impassioned speech in defense of the Indians.

Missionaries Samuel Worcester and Elizur Butler were arrested for their opposition to Indian removal and their case went to the U.S. Supreme Court. Chief Justice John Marshall ruled in favor of the Cherokee in Worcester v. Georgia (1832), writing that the Cherokee Nation was a “distinct community” with self-government “in which the laws of Georgia can have no force.”

Justice Joseph Story wrote March 4, 1832: “Thanks be to God, the Court can wash their hands clean of the iniquity of oppressing the Indians and disregarding their rights.”

Noting that the Supreme Court had no power to enforce its edicts, but had to rely on the president to actually implement them, Democrat President Jackson was attributed with saying: “John Marshall has made his decision; now let him enforce it!”

General John E. Wool had sympathy for the Indians and hesitated carrying out the inhumane removal, resulting in Democrat President Martin Van Buren replacing him with General Winfield Scott.

Oh and I wonder what party was in power when the Japanese were interned during WWII.

then got called out by several people and then tried to recover by using large fonts and bold type:


YES, YES, YES it was Genocide of the Armenians and to ignore it or call it anything less for PC reasons is gutless!

Yes, apparently it's hard to stay on topic for some people. Too bad they don't realize it.

[HawgZWylde]

Ahh, so we can count on your support for a culture who was already here, gets outed by another culture who migrated to the land. Or when the xenophobes on the site begin to find their REPLY button.

Support? Specifically what are we to support? Is there a plan to do something that we are supposed to support and if there is, what is it?


OH wait a minute, you're one of those xenophobes yourself:

Hmm, wasn't somebody crying about us big bad righties calling certain folks names around here? And you wonder why?


http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?83809-Advertisements-in-Spanish

(http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?83809-Advertisements-in-Spanish)Confused much?

He's not the confused one...

[DarkShadow]

Support? Specifically what are we to support? Is there a plan to do something that we are supposed to support and if there is, what is it?

According to Dev, he's all for the Native American cause, thus you know who he is specifically supporting. Do you read? Unless of course, he was cherry picking, but Dev would never do that.


Hmm, wasn't somebody crying about us big bad righties calling certain folks names around here? And you wonder why?

Says the person who calls everyone who disagrees with him "Libtards." You set the rules of the engagement, and now you're backing off? Typical, Cerdo. And BTW, Xenophobe isn't a 'name.' It's a description, a description that you claimed for yourself once you made those xenophobic (http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?83809-Advertisements-in-Spanish&p=762539#post762539) comments in regards to Spanish language appearing on people's ads. Or did you forget what you wrote?


He's not the confused one...

Yeah, you took ownership of that moniker a long time ago.

•

At least you know how to quote now. And they say you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

[HawgZWylde]

According to Dev, he's all for the Native American cause, thus you know who he is specifically supporting. Do you read? Unless of course, he was cherry picking, but Dev would never do that.

Dev has Native American blood and he is proud of it, good on him. But he, like a lot of other Native Americans do not support an open border or the millions who have crossed our sovereign border ILLEGALLY. He is not a part of the progressive's left's attempts to use culture and class to divide this nation. Now I ask you again, what is the cause that we are supposed to support? What are the cause's goals?



Says the person who calls everyone who disagrees with him "Libtards." You set the rules of the engagement, and now you're backing off? Typical, Cerdo. And BTW, Xenophobe isn't a 'name.' It's a description, a description that you claimed for yourself once you made those xenophobic (http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?83809-Advertisements-in-Spanish&p=762539#post762539) comments in regards to Spanish language appearing on people's ads. Or did you forget what you wrote?

I challenge you to find one example where I called progressive left socialists aka Liberals "Libtards" on this site. This is too funny, it's hard to imagine a Liberal crying about name calling and character assassination when they perfected it decades ago and is used by them, here, to this day. Like I said to LQ, you guys drew first blood long ago and continue it to this day so right back at ya bub. Oh, did you bother reading the links I posted on that post? So with your responses you are saying you support that behavior? What did you say that cause was we're supposed to support?




Yeah, you took ownership of that moniker a long time ago.

I support the constitution of the United states of America. I support the fact that we are a nation of laws and that those laws are being disregarded by illegals and their supporters for a political cause. I support our laws establishing our sovereign borders.I support free market capitalism, not cronyism. I support a limited federal government and support the fact that we are supposed to be a constitution based federal republic, not a social democracy. And I support Brent Ehrler and his quest to win the Elite series event at the Delta happening right now. See, I'm not confused.


•

:Finger:


At least you know how to quote now. And they say you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

Oh that's right, you're "DS THE IT GUY" who never, ever has finger farts and a quick "post" finger...

[etucker1959]

Says the person who wrote this in regards to the Armenian Genocide, then blamed someone else for steering them off topic (thanks Etucker):



then got called out by several people and then tried to recover by using large fonts and bold type:



Yes, apparently it's hard to stay on topic for some people. Too bad they don't realize it.
Hey, I want to address the taking us off topic comment. (I think I had a very relevant point) Hopefully my reading compression skills haven't gone to Hell in a hand basket just yet. (Seal, stop laughing!!!!!!) I felt the topic was the American President (in this case Obama) wasn't giving the Armenian people their dues by admitting the Turks (the old Ottoman Empire) of committing Genocide against the Armenian people. My point was, "Why would you expect an outrageous condemnation by an American President to a group of people half way around the world, when an equally cruel Genocide was committed right here in America, by the American government against it's very own people!!!!" I feel we haven't done enough apologizing to our OWN native Americans by our Presidents or Congress. So where is the outrage there!!!!!!!

[City Dad]

Hey, I want to address the taking us off topic comment. (I think I had a very relevant point) Hopefully my reading compression skills haven't gone to Hell in a hand basket just yet. (Seal, stop laughing!!!!!!) I felt the topic was the American President (in this case Obama) wasn't giving the Armenian people their dues by admitting the Turks (the old Ottoman Empire) of committing Genocide against the Armenian people. My point was, "Why would you expect an outrageous condemnation by an American President to a group of people half way around the world, when an equally cruel Genocide was committed right here in America, by the American government against it's very own people!!!!" I feel we haven't done enough apologizing to our OWN native Americans by our Presidents or Congress. So where is the outrage there!!!!!!!

yeah... it'$ really curiou$ how or current pre$ident and all other pa$t pre$ident$ have been $o careful to avoid embara$$ing Turkey.

[etucker1959]

yeah... it'$ really curiou$ how or current pre$ident and all other pa$t pre$ident$ have been $o careful to avoid embara$$ing Turkey.
Let's go a little deeper into a history lesson. It might help explain there isn't the huge smoking gun the Armenians claim there is in a Turkish Genocide against the Armenians. We are back in 1915 WW1 is going on, the Armenians clearly support the Russians who are on the other side of the conflict. The Armenians stage a uprising in Turkey. What do you expect the Turks to do but put down the Revolt staged by the Armenians. (Both sides agree up to this point that's what happened) The Turks then put down the revolt with what else but violence. They then scattered the Armenians people all through out their Empire!!!! The Armenians now claim the Turks did a Genocide on them, the Turks say it was WAR and they were just putting down an uprising of people in their own country. Yes there was plenty of killings and atrocity's committed on both sides. BUT does that make it a Genocide?????? The losing side, "always claims the winners were too hard on them." That may be one of the reasons why the American Presidents aren't so quick to throw the Turks under the bus in calling it a Genocide. I hope I stayed on topic with my comments on this one!!!!! lol

[City Dad]

Let's go a little deeper into a history lesson. It might help explain there isn't the huge smoking gun the Armenians claim there is in a Turkish Genocide against the Armenians. We are back in 1915 WW1 is going on, the Armenians clearly support the Russians who are on the other side of the conflict. The Armenians stage a uprising in Turkey. What do you expect the Turks to do but put down the Revolt staged by the Armenians. (Both sides agree up to this point that's what happened) The Turks then put down the revolt with what else but violence. They then scattered the Armenians people all through out their Empire!!!! The Armenians now claim the Turks did a Genocide on them, the Turks say it was WAR and they were just putting down an uprising of people in their own country. Yes there was plenty of killings and atrocity's committed on both sides. BUT does that make it a Genocide?????? The losing side, "always claims the winners were too hard on them." That may be one of the reasons the American Presidents aren't so quick to throw the Turks under the bus in calling it a Genocide. I hope I stayed on topic with my comments on this one!!!!! lol

so, if both sides committed atrocities, then it cannot be classified as "genocide?" (Personally, I find Mankind's insistence on assigning degrees to mass murder pretty kinda shameful.)