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Bucket bay
09-27-2007, 05:15 PM
Potential Deterrence Methods for
Pacific Harbor Seals & California Sea Lions
May 2006
The following list of “potential methods” and “deterrents to avoid” is not an exhaustive list of non-lethal methods or techniques. If you have questions about protecting your property and/or fishing gear and catch from nuisance Pacific harbor seals and California seal lions, please contact our marine mammal specialists: Brent Norberg, 206-526-6733; Garth Griffin, 503-231-2005; Lynne Barre, 206-526-4745.
Note: Some of the methods listed (such as loud noise or pyrotechnics) may not be appropriate for use in some areas, or are subject to prohibition under federal, state or local ordinances. The presence of Endangered Species Act-listed species in some areas may advise against the use of certain methods. Please consult with appropriate authorities to determine if such prohibitions exist in your area, or if ESA-listed species may be encountered.
Potential methods for use by private property owners to deter Pacific harbor seals and California seal lions from damaging property (developed waterfront, decks, docks, floats, piers, bait receivers, vessels at anchor, etc.).
Barriers & Exclusion Devices:
• fencing (e.g., plastic construction/snow fence, chain link)
• closely spaced posts
• bull rails
• electric livestock fencing
• netting
• swim step protector
Visual Repellents:
• flags, pinwheels, or streamers
• flashing lights or strobes
• balloons
• human attendants/monitors
Noise Makers:
• horns, whistles, bells
• electronic acoustic devices (Acoustic Harassment Devices)
• clapping, banging on pots, pans, drums; empty aluminum cans on a string banging together
• music
• starter pistols
• pyrotechnics (e.g., bird screamers, bangers, firecrackers, propane canons)
Physical Contact:
• high or low pressure water hoses
• sprinklers, sprayers
• crowder boards
• bull poles (blunt tip), brooms
• cattle prod (these products produce only a mild electric shock designed for handling livestock and are in no way related to “stun guns” designed for self-defense)
• toy water guns (e.g., “Super Soaker©”)
• paint ball or air soft guns
• slingshot
• chemical irritants (e.g., non-toxic pepper spray, mace) used for animal control (there are many municipal and state ordinances controlling the use and possession of these irritants)
Note: Guard dogs are not included on the list of suggested measures because of risks to both dogs and marine mammals, including the potential risk of disease transmission between them.
Potential methods for use by fishers to deter Pacific harbor seals and California seal lions from damaging gear or catch (anglers must be actively fishing with gear deployed).
Visual Repellents/Noise Makers:
• boat hazing, circling
• pounding on hull
• pyrotechnics (e.g., bird screamers, bangers, underwater firecrackers, cracker shells)
• starter pistols
• horns, bells, whistles
Physical Contact:
• slingshots
• paint ball guns
• non-lethal ammunition (e.g., rubber bullets, sabot rounds, game stingers)
Methods to Avoid – The following methods and techniques have an increased likelihood of causing injury or death and should be avoided.
• No Firearms with “live” (lethal) ammunition
• No Devices with Injurious Projectiles (e.g., archery gear, crossbows, spear guns, bangsticks)
• No Sharp/Pointed Objects (e.g., harpoons, spears, gaffs, nail studded bats/poles/clubs)
• No Entangling Devices (e.g., loose webbing, snares, concertina wire)
• No Aggressive Tactile Methods (e.g., striking animals with bats, hammers etc., impact with vehicles or boats )
• No Tainted Baits or Poisons
Act Responsibly and Use Common Sense! - Regardless of method or intent, the property owner or fisher may be subject to prosecution should a marine mammal be seriously injured or killed as a result of deterrence efforts for the protection of property, gear or catch.
Remember Personal Safety! - Attempts by property owners and/or fishers to deter nuisance animals from engaging in unwanted behaviors using non-lethal means is a personal choice and not without risk (to the person doing the deterring and anyone around them). Sea lions and seals are wild animals that may react unpredictably to non-lethal deterrence measures, resulting in personal injury or additional damage to property. Sea lions are large and powerful animals that can move as quickly as a person on land.
Be Aware of People around You and be Courteous! - The safe use of some of the above-listed potential methods (e.g., cracker shells, non-lethal ammunition) requires considerable skill and experience. The use of some of these methods may precipitate undesirable social interactions. If you are in possession of a firearm, law enforcement officers approaching your property or vessel will assume that your firearm is loaded with lethal ammunition.
Individuals attempting to deter nuisance sea lions and seals, using the above-listed potential methods or similar techniques, do so at their own risk.

willis949
09-27-2007, 05:22 PM
When we were on the Freelance the captain busted out the trusty paintball gun.They said that it was legal and pretty effective too.

SanDimasLMB
09-30-2007, 03:16 PM
When we were on the Freelance the captain busted out the trusty paintball gun.They said that it was legal and pretty effective too.

I've personally tries 12ga. Riot rounds (Rubber Shot) work pretty darn well.

hookemdano
09-30-2007, 05:52 PM
Where did you get this list?

I didn't realize you could paintball 'em. That adds a lot more enjoyment to a day of fishing. But I would still check with local authorities before taking any of the listed actions.

valhalla_1_2000
09-30-2007, 06:25 PM
http://www.marinemammalcenter.org/learn ... uspect.asp (http://www.marinemammalcenter.org/learning/comm/seal_lion_suspect.asp)

I was on an overnight trip out of San Diego on an unnamed boat a couple years ago when the "captain" decided to start shooting seals with a .22 rifle. I was in total shock, the, hot, empty shell casings were actually falling all over the decks. Definitely not worth the risk, especially if you're in Mexican waters.

LA Smoker
10-01-2007, 12:22 PM
Thanks Bucket! Now I know what to do with all my leftover fire.... errr noisemakers from 4th of July!

ThemBastards
10-01-2007, 01:17 PM
The paintballs have to be normal ones though. You can't use pepper balls or any other type of irritant in the balls.

sansou
10-01-2007, 01:24 PM
When we were on the Freelance the captain busted out the trusty paintball gun.They said that it was legal and pretty effective too.

I've personally tries 12ga. Riot rounds (Rubber Shot) work pretty darn well.

Did you do this on a cattleboat??????

one_leg
10-01-2007, 01:29 PM
They forgot to include telepathically requesting that they kindly leave the area at their earliest possible convenience.

One_Leg

vanillagurilla
10-01-2007, 07:16 PM
dosnt say you cant "freeze" the paint balls :)

sansou
10-01-2007, 07:21 PM
dosnt say you cant "freeze" the paint balls :)

Read the regs.

(can't break skin)

valhalla_1_2000
10-01-2007, 08:56 PM
The easiest legal way to keep the dogs away would clearly be to blast Britney Spears tunes as loudly as possible. Of course, the phychological operations units in the military have long used this tactic to break down and completely demoralize the enemy in combat situations.

jplee3
10-02-2007, 11:29 AM
I sorta want to pickup a slingshot now :)

ThemBastards
10-02-2007, 11:31 AM
dosnt say you cant "freeze" the paint balls :)

Read the regs.

(can't break skin)

I have been shot with frozen paint balls before and they did not break my skin. I am a large mammalian beast but I would guess they have thicker skin than we do. Frozen you could put out an eye though, so maybe a bit too much. Then again I've daydreamed of going Rambo on their a$$es and jumping in the water with a blade and shanking them... but that's just me.


I sorta want to pickup a slingshot now :)

Slingshots are sooooo hard to get really good with. Very very hard to aim.

sansou
10-02-2007, 12:13 PM
ThemBastards,

You are just a very tough guy.

jplee3
10-02-2007, 12:19 PM
I sorta want to pickup a slingshot now :)

Slingshots are sooooo hard to get really good with. Very very hard to aim.

Well then, I guess I'll be getting lots of practice :D

SanDimasLMB
10-02-2007, 04:33 PM
When we were on the Freelance the captain busted out the trusty paintball gun.They said that it was legal and pretty effective too.

I've personally tries 12ga. Riot rounds (Rubber Shot) work pretty darn well.

Did you do this on a cattleboat??????

Hell No!!!!!!

I was on my friends PB

Brian_GSC
10-09-2007, 09:54 PM
Paintball guns work pretty well.

I too have been on MANY boats that have shot at seals with live ammunition. I've also watched one captain gaff a seal when it got close to the boat.

SanDimasLMB
10-10-2007, 05:34 PM
Paintball guns work pretty well.

I too have been on MANY boats that have shot at seals with live ammunition. I've also watched one captain gaff a seal when it got close to the boat.

Personally, I would have reported this to the DFG. I don't care if its the crew of the Excel or ANY boat, I would report them.

sesgia
10-10-2007, 11:04 PM
Paintball guns work pretty well.

I too have been on MANY boats that have shot at seals with live ammunition. I've also watched one captain gaff a seal when it got close to the boat.

Personally, I would have reported this to the DFG. I don't care if its the crew of the Excel or ANY boat, I would report them.

is like the same thing but a bigger fish eat fish and people paid good money to on trip
how would you feel if you hook up like a 60lb yellow or WSB and half way the "*bigger fish*" took it and all was there was just some part of the fish.
i personally would allow the use of 22. (rubber shell only) no head shot

sansou
10-10-2007, 11:13 PM
How effective are electric cattle prods at deterring these guys? Does anyone know?

I personally would ban the angling, commercial and sport, of any predatory sharks in the coastal areas (say 0 to 20 nm off the coast). Let nature restore the balance. (of course I say this cause I have no interest in catching makos or any other sharks) :D

sesgia
10-10-2007, 11:22 PM
How effective are electric cattle prods at deterring these guys? Does anyone know?

I personally would ban the angling, commercial and sport, of any predatory sharks in the coastal areas (say 0 to 20 nm off the coast). Let nature restore the balance. (of course I say this cause I have no interest in catching makos or any other sharks) :D

i'm heading out the end of the months for some makos that are 50+ whos want to join me :D (need to protect the beach from the big one)

SanDimasLMB
10-12-2007, 04:02 PM
Paintball guns work pretty well.

I too have been on MANY boats that have shot at seals with live ammunition. I've also watched one captain gaff a seal when it got close to the boat.

Personally, I would have reported this to the DFG. I don't care if its the crew of the Excel or ANY boat, I would report them.

is like the same thing but a bigger fish eat fish and people paid good money to on trip
how would you feel if you hook up like a 60lb yellow or WSB and half way the "*bigger fish*" took it and all was there was just some part of the fish.
i personally would allow the use of 22. (rubber shell only) no head shot

I wouldn't give a sh*t about my 60lb. WSB if a seal was going to be GAFFED OR SHOT AT WITH LIVE AMMUNITION!!!!!!
Thats just nature and how the food chain works. A big fish see's a weak fish as easy food.





i personally would allow the use of 22. (rubber shell only) no head shot

Also, just because its a .22 calibre bullet doesn't mean it won't kill the seal. If you look at the ballistics of a .22LR bullet the least it would do to a seal is kill it. .22LR bullet can do MUCH more than that.





If you think the gaffing of a seal is better than a 60lb. WSB you're f***ed up.

ghetto dad
10-12-2007, 04:32 PM
kevin doesnt want to deter them, he wants to trap them for the Q!!!

ymin72
10-12-2007, 05:19 PM
SDLMB - so are you saying that its ok for YOU to shoot a seal but not anyone else.

I have never seen anyone try to intentionally gaff a seal. No one is stupid or strong enough to. They might use the gaff to deter them away from the fish but trying to stick them..... i dont think so.

Brian_GSC
10-13-2007, 12:59 PM
SDLMB - so are you saying that its ok for YOU to shoot a seal but not anyone else.

I have never seen anyone try to intentionally gaff a seal. No one is stupid or strong enough to. They might use the gaff to deter them away from the fish but trying to stick them..... i dont think so.

The capt was not trying to gaff it and bring it onboard. He had the gaff in the water, and waited for the seal to come by, when it was close he gaffed it quickly, then quickly got the gaff out of the seal. The seal made a noise, and swam off. We were in a good yellow bite and the seal was becoming a pain. I am not saying what he did was right...however I did not feel sorry for the seal. I guess I just viewed the captain as "the bigger fish".

I agree with Sansou...we need more sharks.

One way to control the seal population would be to sell tags for seals. Say....$500 per tag. I don't know about you, but I would pay $500 to bag a seal. I have lost too many WSB, cuda, and yellows to the dogs. We could then donate the meat to the homeless. It is a win-win. The state of CA gets revenue, I get to bag a seal, and the less fortunate get some food.

SanDimasLMB
10-13-2007, 03:58 PM
SDLMB - so are you saying that its ok for YOU to shoot a seal but not anyone else.

I have never seen anyone try to intentionally gaff a seal. No one is stupid or strong enough to. They might use the gaff to deter them away from the fish but trying to stick them..... i dont think so.

He is reffering to shoot seals with live ammunition as opposed to use of my rubber riot rounds.

ymin72
10-13-2007, 04:03 PM
Paintball guns work pretty well.

I too have been on MANY boats that have shot at seals with live ammunition. I've also watched one captain gaff a seal when it got close to the boat.

Personally, I would have reported this to the DFG. I don't care if its the crew of the Excel or ANY boat, I would report them.

is like the same thing but a bigger fish eat fish and people paid good money to on trip
how would you feel if you hook up like a 60lb yellow or WSB and half way the "*bigger fish*" took it and all was there was just some part of the fish.
i personally would allow the use of 22. (rubber shell only) no head shot

Read carefully little buddy.

SanDimasLMB
10-13-2007, 04:28 PM
is like the same thing but a bigger fish eat fish and people paid good money to on trip
how would you feel if you hook up like a 60lb yellow or WSB and half way the "*bigger fish*" took it and all was there was just some part of the fish.
i personally would allow the use of 22. (rubber shell only) no head shot.

Read carefully little buddy

That clears things up I guess. However, to my knowledge there are no such things such as .22 rubber rounds as .22 is already a small calibre