Are the bonito back in KH?

[KidTrout]

Just wondered if they were back in king harbor out in Redondo Beach. Read a report on it and was hoping maybe they are making a return. I might go down on sunday if anyone is catching them. Thanks.

[SP Dan]

Respond on DR's report for answers to your questions!

SP dan <"))>< "The Danimal"!

[DockRat]

Those Tuna can go 50 miles+ a day.
Hit or miss and mostly misses the last decade.
I have had 20 + straight skunks with just occasional good mackerel sessions BUT when it is good it is really fun on light gear for some serious drag burners. I'll fish usually 20 minutes to one hour on a typical session after work. LC, Kroc then Kastmaster and sometimes a clear bubble 1/2 full of water with a 8' leader and a fly.

The day after the sardines died a couple years ago when they were chased into the shallow corner of the harbor was EPIC ! Every single cast was a hookup. Landed 50 + huge 26" Mackerel and 7 Bonito. Ended up using a iron jig with a single hook for faster C&R. Myself and a friend Shawn were the only ones fishing.
When you quite fishing after 1 1/2 hours because you tired of catching so many fish that is the best it gets.

It was insane. That's why I check almost everyday and usually don't fish, just a quick look.
I look for Birds, Bait, Seals and Steam. That is the key (tip) to KH fishing on the rocks. Birds sitting on the breakwall and seals sleeping on the seal platform = usually not much Mackerel/Bonito action.
DR

[DockRat]

For you guys that have never fished or seen the popper method.

This video below shows Old School Bubble Popper Fly Fishing Style how they did it in the 1960's 70's in KH.
Spinning reels is what guys use and with the heavy bubble and 8 lb to 15 lb main line and 6 lb test leader.
Some guys use a 3' to 4' length leader, others 6' to 12'. Best with a 10' 12' rod. With the bubble about 1/2 to 3/4 full of water and log rod you can cast 100' to 150'. With the long leader you have to lay the fly and line on a flat rock behind you on the backstroke of the cast. This is wher the long rod is a advantage.

I use my 8' 6" spinner rod that is always in my car 24/7 always stored in a bent position.:LOL:

The splash simulates a surface strike and gets the attention of the fish around the area. They swim by to investigate then see the fly go by they attack it.

Am I the only one on FNN that still fishes this method in 2013 ?
I bet Jerry fished the bubble back in the day ?
DR


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbpENOlXTJc

[bman90278]

Yes the Bones have been in the King Harbor, but u gotta find them. I've seen a couple larger models caught recently, one being on the Short Pier. If u really want some bones, u might have the best luck on a boat or float tube.

-brian

[Hometown]

I havnt fished that rig for a long time .Do you remember TC bait and tackle Tim

[DockRat]

Thanks for the Intel Bman. Float tubes are illegal in KH. If you see the cops down there tell them them DR said :Finger: and leave us fishermen alone.:mad:

I support Cops but then they pull that Bullsh!t and wrote that illegal ticket I got so pissed off that there would be no stopping me to fight RBPD and the city to win and make sure the area remains open to all fishermen.

[DockRat]

I remember TC. Didn't fish much SW back then just surfed and free/scuba diving with a speargun and lobster.

[jerryG]

You called it Martin.. The bubble and feather was my go to back in the day. I used to tie my own bonito feathers and I would fish an 11' rod with either a bubble or a home made splasher.

I would tie a feather 4' behind my bubble or splasher, then I would tie a second feather 18" behind the first one and then I would tie a third feather 18" behind the second one. I used the triple feather rig when the smaller bonito were around but when the big boys rolled in I would use a single feather. The triple feather rig got bit better than the single and if I didn't get a double or triple hook up on initially I would free spool and the let the bonita swim back to the school pulling the feathers along with him.. Triple almost every time.. Those were the days..

[DockRat]

There was a guy last week with the exact same rig you explained, he had pre tied rigs wrapped around a paper towel center. Seen guys use a larger sabiki rigs too.

Couple years ago when the Bonito were in most tossed the single and a few had the multi feather. I've always tossed the single and not trying the multi but your methods have me wanting to get serious about trying it.

The problem with the long rod is too stiff for me since I prefer light action and more of a noodle stick because the bones have been smaller the last few years.

It is all about the fight for myself and drag burners.
Mark Wisch owner of Pacific Edge and a charter captain has a few books out.
In his latest book Between Two and Twenty Fathoms
Second Edition which I picked he writes that in So Cal Bonito are the hardest fighting fish pound for pound.

Haven't surf fished all summer just boat and jetty. I really have no interest at this at this time in my life to target halibut anymore and want to get back to some real fishing action. Not meaning to disrespect surf fishermen just tired of it personally and would rather do something else.

Check this kid (east coast) same action as west coast Bonito.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR-2HhJSzyk

[etucker1959]

I see some great info about catching the bonies from the rocks. When I use to fish KH, I always did it from a boat. So let me give you some basic boat tactics. Start by trolling a Rapala or a green&yellow Bonito feather on #6 test. Troll the whole harbor and take notes of where you were getting bit. Once you figured out a good area, time to buy some anchovies. Same #6 test line on a number 4 bait holder style hook and fly line your bait. You could anchor your boat or drift, just stay out of the main channel. Don't forget every time you get a fresh bait throw a couple of them over for chum. Seeing those Bonito explode on your bait was quite exciting.

[jerryG]

There was a guy last week with the exact same rig you explained, he had pre tied rigs wrapped around a paper towel center. Seen guys use a larger sabiki rigs too.

Couple years ago when the Bonito were in most tossed the single and a few had the multi feather. I've always tossed the single and not trying the multi but your methods have me wanting to get serious about trying it.

The problem with the long rod is too stiff for me since I prefer light action and more of a noodle stick because the bones have been smaller the last few years.

It is all about the fight for myself and drag burners.
Mark Wisch owner of Pacific Edge and a charter captain has a few books out.
In his latest book Between Two and Twenty Fathoms
Second Edition which I picked he writes that in So Cal Bonito are the hardest fighting fish pound for pound.

Haven't surf fished all summer just boat and jetty. I really have no interest at this at this time in my life to target halibut anymore and want to get back to some real fishing action. Not meaning to disrespect surf fishermen just tired of it personally and would rather do something else.



Martin-- I was wondering if you had ever used the feather rig for bonita when fishing from a boat?

When I would fish the boats as a kid I used to fish a hand tied feather on a chrome hex head. I would tie a chrome 3 ounce torpedo weight with then 3' of leader and then the feather. I would cast it as far away from the boat as far as I could and fish it with a constant pump action while slowly retrieving. This is the same technique one would use when fishing a mini-jig for trout but instead of an ultralight one would fish it on a long parabolic jig stick with 20 -30lb line ( I used 10' 540 with a Newell converted Penn 500).

This was a technique carried over from earlier generations and was most widely used by the older veteran anglers at the time.. In recent times I have only seen one angler on the boats who still uses this technique and I recall this same angler using this technique when I was a child. I have no doubt that the man was using the technique for several decades I before I came into existence. Through the years when I have seen this guy fish for bonita (and barracuda too) he KILLS and I Means KILLS them on the feather rig.

I don't know why this technique was lost because it is absolutely DEADLY on bonita and kills the cuda as well. I have had several old timers tell me back in day that Skippers didn't like people to use feather rigs because once the fish would get going on the feathers that's all they would want to eat and they would stop eating live bait.. I don't know if there is any truth to that..

As I understand it this was the go to technique for Southern California Anglers for the first half of the 20th century and beyond. They used to make rods called feather sticks exclusively for this technique. By today's standards a feather stick was basically a long parabolic jig stick. I acquired a an old 11' syloflex blank (feather stick) about 15 years ago. I wrapped it but rarely use it.. I break it out when the bones show up...

I understand about not wanting to fish the surf. I enjoy a wide variety of fishing myself. If I had to pick my favorite I couldn't pick just one but maybe two and that would be inshore/ islands calico bass fishing and offshore fishing. I enjoy fishing the surf, inshore, offshore, kayak, private boat, sport boats, freshwater bass, and stripers. I mix it up..

Jerryg

[etucker1959]

Martin-- I was wondering if you had ever used the feather rig for bonita when fishing from a boat?

When I would fish the boats as a kid I used to fish a hand tied feather on a chrome hex head. I would tie a chrome 3 ounce torpedo weight with then 3' of leader and then the feather. I would cast it as far away from the boat as far as I could and fish it with a constant pump action while slowly retrieving. This is the same technique one would use when fishing a mini-jig for trout but instead of an ultralight one would fish it on a long parabolic jig stick with 20 -30lb line ( I used 10' 540 with a Newell converted Penn 500).

This was a technique carried over from earlier generations and was most widely used by the older veteran anglers at the time.. In recent times I have only seen one angler on the boats who still uses this technique and I recall this same angler using this technique when I was a child. I have no doubt that the man was using the technique for several decades I before I came into existence. Through the years when I have seen this guy fish for bonita (and barracuda too) he KILLS and I Means KILLS them on the feather rig.

I don't know why this technique was lost because it is absolutely DEADLY on bonita and kills the cuda as well. I have had several old timers tell me back in day that Skippers didn't like people to use feather rigs because once the fish would get going on the feathers that's all they would want to eat and they would stop eating live bait.. I don't know if there is any truth to that..

As I understand it this was the go to technique for Southern California Anglers for the first half of the 20th century and beyond. They used to make rods called feather sticks exclusively for this technique. By today's standards a feather stick was basically a long parabolic jig stick. I acquired a an old 11' syloflex blank (feather stick) about 15 years ago. I wrapped it but rarely use it.. I break it out when the bones show up...

I understand about not wanting to fish the surf. I enjoy a wide variety of fishing myself. If I had to pick my favorite I couldn't pick just one but maybe two and that would be inshore/ islands calico bass fishing and offshore fishing. I enjoy fishing the surf, inshore, offshore, kayak, private boat, sport boats, freshwater bass, and stripers. I mix it up..

Jerryg

I know this question was written for my BFF DockRat, but I do have an answer to a couple of your questions. The big question is why the feather technique was lost even though it still works. It was lost or more accurately replaced for two reasons. Back in the 70's when I cut my teeth on saltwater fishing, I remember this technique working quite well. Back then we didn't have the really good Barracuda irons we have today. The original Tady lure was a piece of bent metal as we called it. No such thing as a Tady 45 or Tady C like we have today. Remember when the UFO lures first came out, totally deadly on Barracuda and Bonita. Even those got replaced by something better. Thinking back, what was the live bait situation then? Or more accurately the Fin Baits we had to fish with, Anchovies only!!!!! I never even saw a Sardine in the bait tank all thru the 70's and early 80's. When all's we had to fish with were pinback anchovies, the feather option looked pretty good. Since we no longer have any inshore Bonita to catch, just Barracuda the feather jigs just lost their popularity.

[jerryG]

I know this question was written for my BFF DockRat, but I do have an answer to a couple of your questions. The big question is why the feather technique was lost even though it still works. It was lost or more accurately replaced for two reasons. Back in the 70's when I cut my teeth on saltwater fishing, I remember this technique working quite well. Back then we didn't have the really good Barracuda irons we have today. The original Tady lure was a piece of bent metal as we called it. No such thing as a Tady 45 or Tady C like we have today. Remember when the UFO lures first came out, totally deadly on Barracuda and Bonita. Even those got replaced by something better. Thinking back, what was the live bait situation then? Or more accurately the Fin Baits we had to fish with, Anchovies only!!!!! I never even saw a Sardine in the bait tank all thru the 70's and early 80's. When all's we had to fish with were pinback anchovies, the feather option looked pretty good. Since we no longer have any inshore Bonita to catch, just Barracuda the feather jigs just lost their popularity.


Anchovies were the primary bait in the 70s-80s and I would imagine anytime before that as well. It's reflected in the tackle at the time. You didn't leave the dock with out a bait stick (parabolic rods with whip like action for casting anchovies) but these days those rods have lost their place in the tackle arsenals of most saltwater Anglers due the change in the bait cycle. Back then anchovies were definitely the predominant bait. Then in the 90's sardines took over and became the more predominant bait. In recent years we have seen the squid start increase in numbers. Its not predominant numbers have definitely been on an up swing.

It's funny you mention UFO lures because I knew the founder (Dick Uranga) of UFO and what later became Iron Man Lures. I caught my personal best halibut aboard his boat the Predator II. He was a great man and a funny man.. He would keep everyone laughing all day and he would get you.. I would go to take a drink of my gatorade and then find a squid head floating around in my drink... He used to give me a hard time because I was a Tady guy and there were a couple times I went on his boat and out fished him with Tady's.. He would say that's it!!! your swimming back to the dock Jerry. He told me stories about him and a buddy fishing for trout at Castiac. He said he was watching his buddy eat his sandwich and laughing because he put salmon eggs in his buddies sandwich only to bite into his own sandwich and find that his had put night crawlers in his sandwich. He lost the fight with cancer a few years ago..

As much as I love throwing the iron and as much confidence as I have in the ability of jigs to consistently catch fish based on my own experiences I have no hesitation in saying when it comes to fishing for bonita the feather rig is going to put a lot more fish on the boat.. I believe jigs have a slight upper had over feathers when it comes to barracuda. Actually long before Tady, Salas, Sea Strike, UFO, killer, II Sharp, and .... came into being anglers used bones jigs made out of whale bone. If you have ever held one of these jigs the weight is perfect. The shapes are comparable to the jigs of today but the swimming action of these antique jigs is off the charts. The surface jigs of today were originally molded after the old bone jigs. The few I have seen kicked hard and swam amazing well. It's funny something becomes popular and as a consequence another technique is put on the shelf and forgotten. No doubt about it Anglers are big on following trends but if something worked great in the past there is no reason for it not to work great in the present.

JerryG

[DockRat]

Never done the torpedo fly but want to now. Do you think it would work off the rocks ?
Surprised you and Etuck didn't mention the Candy Bar ? I tossed the Tady some and chrome diamond jigs some. The diamond was good for Cuda. I have one Bone Jig with a single hook but would not to ever use it.

I fished the live anchovy on the swivel slide. Toss a 2 oz lead (no hook) way out there, reel in the slack, lean the rod on the pier rail. You have a 3' leader ready with a snap swivel and a #2 hook on the other end. Then you go buy a live anchovy (10 cents I think ?) Then run back and nose hook it, snap the swivel on and let it slide down to the water. That method worked good too.

Never boat fished KH much. Lots of dive trips out of KH and sailing. Helped do a delivery on a 60' Santana in 1985, Newport to Cabo race. Flew down with a couple buddies, brought a couple tuna feathers, 20' of 60 lb mono and 80' of 1/8" rope. Rigged some rubber tubing about 4' with a sag loop in the rope so if you saw the rope go tight you would know 'Fish On'. Motor sailed with only the main sail up the whole way into the swells and wind. The rich owners and crew would race down (2 days) down wind, down swell, spinnakers, then fly back. They would hire sailors (no pay) and pay the flight, food. It was just a free trip.

600 miles of trolling for about 10 Bonito around 10 lbs each, 8 days trolling. LOL
Some of the Bonito water skied for hours and came in stiff. Must have been because we went though several cases of Mexican beers and 1/2 the guys were popping pain pills we got at a Cabo Farmacia :LOL: :Secret:
DR

[DockRat]

Bob Meistrell of Dive N Surf, Body Glove Memorial Paddle Out Tomorrow at Topaz/Veterans Park 9:00 am. I'll be on a early 60's Green Rick Longboard. Bob and his twin brother Bill are getting statues in there memory made and will be put up soon. RB city council voted for them last tuesday. Nobody voted no.
RIP Bob.

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m226/SUBARCH/12-29-2012%20Santa%20Monica%20Bay/untitledshoot-0040_zps74c47f00.jpg (http://media.photobucket.com/user/SUBARCH/media/12-29-2012%20Santa%20Monica%20Bay/untitledshoot-0040_zps74c47f00.jpg.html)

[etucker1959]

Never done the torpedo fly but want to now. Do you think it would work off the rocks ?
Surprised you and Etuck didn't mention the Candy Bar ? I tossed the Tady some and chrome diamond jigs some. The diamond was good for Cuda. I have one Bone Jig with a single hook but would not to ever use it.

I fished the live anchovy on the swivel slide. Toss a 2 oz lead (no hook) way out there, reel in the slack, lean the rod on the pier rail. You have a 3' leader ready with a snap swivel and a #2 hook on the other end. Then you go buy a live anchovy (10 cents I think ?) Then run back and nose hook it, snap the swivel on and let it slide down to the water. That method worked good too.

Never boat fished KH much. Lots of dive trips out of KH and sailing. Helped do a delivery on a 60' Santana in 1985, Newport to Cabo race. Flew down with a couple buddies, brought a couple tuna feathers, 20' of 60 lb mono and 80' of 1/8" rope. Rigged some rubber tubing about 4' with a sag loop in the rope so if you saw the rope go tight you would know 'Fish On'. Motor sailed with only the main sail up the whole way into the swells and wind. The rich owners and crew would race down (2 days) down wind, down swell, spinnakers, then fly back. They would hire sailors (no pay) and pay the flight, food. It was just a free trip.

600 miles of trolling for about 10 Bonito around 10 lbs each, 8 days trolling. LOL
Some of the Bonito water skied for hours and came in stiff. Must have been because we went though several cases of Mexican beers and 1/2 the guys were popping pain pills we got at a Cabo Farmacia :LOL: :Secret:
DR

That's so funny DR, because I knew someone was going to call me on the Candy bar lures. Besides the swimming action on some lures being improved. I think we made leap and bounds up grades in today's jig colors. I don't think in years past, the colors of the jigs were not even close to what we have today. DR, I'm sorry you never got to sample the Bonita fishing in years past with live anchovies in King Harbor. To hook those things on a pole you could trout fish with, "was the GREATEST fight would ever get on light spinning tackle."

[DockRat]

That's so funny DR, because I knew someone was going to call me on the Candy bar lures. Besides the swimming action on some lures being improved. I think we made leap and bounds up grades in today's jig colors. I don't think in years past, the colors of the jigs were not even close to what we have today. DR, I'm sorry you never got to sample the Bonita fishing in years past with live anchovies in King Harbor. To hook those things on a pole you could trout fish with, "was the GREATEST fight would ever get on light spinning tackle."


The early and newer Irons have the hole where the ring is offset and not in the center. This gives the Iron the 'kick' that attracts/catches fish. I just learned this a couples years ago and many know this already. Old ones were hand drilled. That and other minor affects is what makes one lure catch fish better than another of the same model.

[etucker1959]

The early and newer Irons have the hole where the ring is offset and not in the center. This gives the Iron the 'kick' that attracts/catches fish. I just learned this a couples years ago and many know this already. Old ones were hand drilled. That and other minor affects is what makes one lure catch fish better than another of the same model.

Right on again DR, in the past and present all irons even though there are the same make and model aren't necessarily the same. (pun intended) Some swim just enough different that makes them killers of fish. Let me tell you a story about a green and yellow Tady C I have. It would outfish all of my other surface irons I had in my box. I was casting it one day on the New Del Mar out of MDR. When I noticed a very large fish cashing it right to the boat, it hit the lure and turned sideways. Oh crap it's a WSB, I'm yelling sea bass, sea bass and grinding on it. Rick Ofinger was running the boat that day and literally grabs the gaff away from his deckhand. He sticks the fish and throws a 25 lbs Sea bass on the deck. I don't know who was happier me or him. I still have that lure as a model, when I try to pick new irons at the tackle shop.

[jerryG]

Right on again DR, in the past and present all irons even though there are the same make and model aren't necessarily the same. (pun intended) Some swim just enough different that makes them killers of fish. Let me tell you a story about a green and yellow Tady C I have. It would outfish all of my other surface irons I had in my box. I was casting it one day on the New Del Mar out of MDR. When I noticed a very large fish cashing it right to the boat, it hit the lure and turned sideways. Oh crap it's a WSB, I'm yelling sea bass, sea bass and grinding on it. Rick Ofinger was running the boat that day and literally grabs the gaff away from his deckhand. He sticks the fish and throws a 25 lbs Sea bass on the deck. I don't know who was happier me or him. I still have that lure as a model, when I try to pick new irons at the tackle shop.

I have long been a huge fan of throwing the iron and as mentioned though cut from the same molds not all jigs are created equally. I place my jigs in to one of four categories the first being rookies which I always start the day throwing and use in a good to wide open bite. This is the proving grounds and also a time when you are most likely to loose a jig due a higher number of fish being caught in the case of barracuda a higher risk of being chewed off or in the case of a sport boat the more people hooked up increases the chance of being sawed off by another anglers line. It's never easy losing a jig but it hurts a lot more to lose a hall of famer jig. Plus when the fish are WO they're going to eat just about any jig in the box.

The next category I always carry are what I would refer to as all star jigs.. These are jigs I would use in a pick bite when the fishing is tough and really need to put some fish on the boat. This is when I need these jigs to work for me and they have proven themselves many times over.

The next category I always carry at least one of is my super star jigs.. These are a very small elite group of jigs that are proven killers which I will rely on in desperate situations to put fish on the boat and find needles in hay stacks.. These are jigs that have been proven time and time, and time again.

The last category is retired jigs. These are jigs that don't swim don't get bit and don't belong in my box.. I compare these jigs to my superstars and look for any inconsistencies in these jigs that may have caused them to perform poorly or in the case of a superstar jig what caused them to perform magnificently. I make some mental notes of what to look for and what to avoid for future purchases. Eventually the retired group will makes their way to the classified section.

JerryG

[DockRat]

Good info Jerry. Caution buying used jigs, Lol.

Short video of Bobs Paddle Out in Redondo. He passed away a couple months ago at Catalina on his boat in the video at 83 years old. It was Great. The event at the Salt Water Lagoon was xlnt too. Lots of legends were there. They had 5 custom longboards made covered with vintage pics under the resin. Bob and Bill were ex military and lifegaurds too. Military honors, 21 gun salute, Coast Guard flyover too.

Bob and Bill Meistrell (twins) started experimenting with neoprene around 1953. They started the company Dive N Surf which the wetsuit would later be named Body Glove.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nop1B4vaGoE

[etucker1959]

I have long been a huge fan of throwing the iron and as mentioned though cut from the same molds not all jigs are created equally. I place my jigs in to one of four categories the first being rookies which I always start the day throwing and use in a good to wide open bite. This is the proving grounds and also a time when you are most likely to loose a jig due a higher number of fish being caught in the case of barracuda a higher risk of being chewed off or in the case of a sport boat the more people hooked up increases the chance of being sawed off by another anglers line. It's never easy losing a jig but it hurts a lot more to lose a hall of famer jig. Plus when the fish are WO they're going to eat just about any jig in the box.

The next category I always carry are what I would refer to as all star jigs.. These are jigs I would use in a pick bite when the fishing is tough and really need to put some fish on the boat. This is when I need these jigs to work for me and they have proven themselves many times over.

The next category I always carry at least one of is my super star jigs.. These are a very small elite group of jigs that are proven killers which I will rely on in desperate situations to put fish on the boat and find needles in hay stacks.. These are jigs that have been proven time and time, and time again.

The last category is retired jigs. These are jigs that don't swim don't get bit and don't belong in my box.. I compare these jigs to my superstars and look for any inconsistencies in these jigs that may have caused them to perform poorly or in the case of a superstar jig what caused them to perform magnificently. I make some mental notes of what to look for and what to avoid for future purchases. Eventually the retired group will makes their way to the classified section.

JerryG

Cool story!!!! I have friends who swear they can pick the great jigs off the pegs. I try to do that, but I end up doing what you do in category 1.