Pelican Kayak, Project [Archive] - Fishing Network Message Boards

fishinone

04-14-2011, 11:00 AM

I found a Pelican kayak listed on Craigslist for $40. It has a 3 foot split in the seam on the port(left) bow.

I went an checked it out last night and wound up getting it for $30.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00461-20110414-0800.jpg
I don't know yet what model it is yet but it's about 10ft long. On the aft deck it has a screw out deck plate, the cover for it is missing.

My plan is to take every thing off of it so that I can repair the seam and make some modifications like adding a bait well, rod holders, tackle tray storage and a trolling motor.

It's all scratched up. It looks like it might have spent some time washing up against a bank or something but it can be made serviceable.

It's perfect for cutting holes in.:Twisted:

I paid $30 for the Kayak last night then bought $50 worth of tools and material to fix it this morning.

I'll post updates here as the project progresses.

vanillagurilla

04-14-2011, 11:23 AM

Time to weld some plastic! Btw it smells bad if thats what your doing lol.

viperman100

04-14-2011, 01:44 PM

That boat had been on craigslist for a couple days now and I almost went for it, but 1- I already have two kayaks and 2-I dont know how to weld plastic so I dont know that I could have fixed it anyways, I probably would have tried resin and fiberglass matting but who knows if that would have worked.

Good luck with the project hope it all works out.

reservoir dog

04-14-2011, 01:47 PM

Not a bad investment. Post pics as your project comes along.

fishinone

04-14-2011, 02:18 PM

Time to weld some plastic! Btw it smells bad if thats what your doing lol.

I'm going to weld it. I'm planning to do it outside in the back yard.

That boat had been on craigslist for a couple days now and I almost went for it, but 1- I already have two kayaks and 2-I dont know how to weld plastic so I dont know that I could have fixed it anyways, I probably would have tried resin and fiberglass matting but who knows if that would have worked.

Good luck with the project hope it all works out.

Thank you,

Before I went and got it I watched some youtube videos and looked at instructions at the link below.

http://www.urethanesupply.com/kcwelder.php

I ordered yellow material and stainless steel screen here but I ordered Harbor Freight's cheapest plastic welder.

http://www.harborfreight.com/plastic-welding-kit-80-watt-iron-67102.html

I'm pretty handy, it should come out OK.

Not a bad investment. Post pics as your project comes along.

Thanks, I'm planning to start with damage pics, after I get it set up on saw horses in the back yard.

It just occurred to me that I should use material that I remove as I make my modifications, for the welding. The color should match.

viperman100

04-14-2011, 03:56 PM

definately do a photo repair thread so others can benefit from the step by step instructions.

tacklejunkie

04-14-2011, 06:47 PM

fishinone

04-14-2011, 09:16 PM

Cool find!

PS, fwiw..
The pelican I bought yesterday the manual says not to set them on sawhorses!
Don't know why and I'm not experienced by any means. Just thought I'd relay that!

It was the first thing I thought of doing with mine but it said not to?!

Thank you,

That's good to know. I think they want you to support it on straps to spread the load.

I might do that but I think just setting down on the grass when I'm not working on it will be good enough.

I brought it into the living room last night for a planning session.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00462-20110414-2012.jpg
It turned out to be a hit with my son.

tacklejunkie

04-15-2011, 04:45 PM

Yup, Looks good!
They said to just set them down flat!
I put mine down on my living room carpet and pretend I'm in a personal rocket ship hehe
Took mine out today for the first time undressed. Get a report going later. You're gonna like your new kayak!

fishinone

04-16-2011, 05:47 PM

I took the kayak apart today by drilling the pop rivet head off with a 3/16" diameter drill bit.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00463-20110416-1556.jpg
Here a picture of the parts.

I took a picture of the split from inside.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00465-20110416-1558.jpg
The split is about 45 inches long.

There's a section of the original weld that was only welded at the very outside edge of the flange. The rest of the seam was welded all way across the seam.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00469-20110416-1706.jpg
This 10 inch weak spot is probably why the seam split in the first place.

Now I can start cutting holes for access to the seam and for fishing modifications.

I'm headed for the back yard right now!:Smile:

tacklejunkie

04-16-2011, 07:12 PM

Doesn't look so bad to fix that!
Already has the paddle holder on the right hand side too.
Looks like you just need a rod holder.
Have fun.
Got a bunch done to mine as well today.

fishinone

04-16-2011, 08:46 PM

I made the first cut and started planning some other mods.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00470-20110416-1842.jpg
I used a Dremel tool with a RotoZip bit. The RotoZip bit has three flutes. They let you control the direction of the cut easier than a two flute cutter.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00472-20110416-1858.jpg
This hole will give me access to the seam way up in the bow.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00473-20110416-1859.jpg
Later the hatch will allow for storage in front of the foot rests. I'm working on a way to flatten the area where the hatch flange is.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00476-20110416-1901.jpg
I'm planning to cut off a bucket and weld it to the deck below where the bucket is in this picture. I ordered some yellow ones last night. I'll use it as a socket for other buckets up to 7 gallons. It think there are buckets made in that diameter in 2, 3.5, 5, 6 and 7 gallon. Different buckets can be set up for different purposes, like a baitwell, dry storage or a cooler. There are also trays that are called bucket organizers that stack in the buckets.

I'll see how the front hatch mod turns out before I decide whether to put a hatch in the back.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00474-20110416-1900.jpg
I got the Plano tackle box in this picture at WalMart for $8.74. I considered cutting a hole and mounting it in it, but it would be in the way of my feet. Now I'm thinking of welding the top off of the back bucket there to make a mount for it. I'm sure I'll use a tackle box in the top of the back bucket. With the tackle box in the top of a bucket it's a pretty comfortable seat for shore fishing or camping.

fishinone

04-20-2011, 10:26 PM

I've been doing some testing with the new tools and different materials.

Last night the tip on my harbor freight iron just broke off while I was working. I had only had the tool for about 30 minutes. This morning I got the broken piece out of the screw hole ground down the shaft on the rest of the tip then threaded it with a 10-24 die. Tonight it was actually bending while I was using it after it heated up, then it broke when I tried to straighten it.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00478-20110420-0603.jpg
Harbor Freight is sending a new kit.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00481-20110420-2126.jpg

Fortunately I stopped at Home Depot and bought some replacement tips on the way home.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00482-20110420-2127.jpg
This Brass screw was a little harder to do smoothing with but it worked well. It didn't bend at all.

Tomorrow I'll make some feet out of some pieces of brass. I've got some brass tubing to make some tube feeders with also.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00479-20110420-2026.jpg
I'm putting screen in this weld.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00480-20110420-2037.jpg
The red spot is weed eater line that I tried, to see if it was the right stuff. It's not.

I broke the weld on the left with my hands after it cooled but the area with the screen in it held.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00483-20110420-2127.jpg
The yellow is welded with welding rod that I bought. The white is welded with strips that I cut off of a bucket lid. The ugly brown is done with strips that I cut out of the weld slot, there is screen under the surface.

The weld strip and the bucket lid both work well and are easy to work with. If you can stand orange, bucket lids are a dollar at Home Depot.

The strips from the kayak are harder to work with because they are made from 2 densities of material. the Ram-X has hard surfaces.

The slot in the screw head made pushing the screen in very easy.

I'm satisfied now that I can fix the 45" split in the seam. It should be stronger than original.

tacklejunkie

04-21-2011, 11:05 AM

That's harsh on the tool breaking over and over again. Typical harbor freight tools made in china stamped OK and reboxed by let me guess "Pittsburg". lol
Been there done that bro.

Hang in there. Looks like tough work but you'll be stoked with a floaty boaty in the end!
Hit me up when she's done for a trip out on the water.

fishinone

04-22-2011, 12:27 PM

I think the tip breaking will work out to be helpful. I made my own tip, it wasn't hard and it cost less. Now I'll make some more for special purposes.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00484-20110421-1950.jpg
This tip is made from a brass plumbing fitting.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00485-20110421-1950.jpg
The rectangular one works better on the flatter surfaces. The triangle should work well in a corner.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00486-20110421-1951.jpg
It was a lot easier to make a better finish.

I'm starting on the boat today!

tacklejunkie

04-23-2011, 04:30 AM

If you can't buy the right tools for the job, make them!
Keep up the good work.

Was that a scrap piece you were testing on or another part of the yak?

Can't wait to take mine out again. Got busy for a bit.
Happy holidays this weekend folks. :Cool:

fishinone

04-23-2011, 07:55 AM

I can buy tips but one cost more than the 8 tips that I made. I made tips with different angles to get into different spaces, etc. I'm planning to shape tips as required also. When I start installing things with inside corners etc. I can make tips that fit and leave a gusset as I drag them.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00487-20110422-1815.jpg
This weld was done with a water jug, it's like a milk jug or a SunnyD bottle. It's easy to work with because it's thin but the yellow buckets are the same material, fill a little faster and match the boat better. The High Density Polyethylene (UHPE) of the water jug and the bucket makes stronger welds than the LDPE (Low Density Polyethylene) of the bucket lid and welding rod but the LDPE is easiest to work with

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00488-20110423-0648.jpg
I've broken every weld that I made in the test piece in the hopes that I won't break the ones in the boat. I've got it to the point now where I have to put the piece in a vice to break it, even without the Stainless Steel screen.:Big Grin: I'm going to put the screen in anyway.

Patience makes better welds. The weld material has to be melted through and the surface underneath melted also. Melt the rod down into the groove to fill it then push the melted material out of the groove with the tool and melt the surface of the groove quickly and put the molten material back in the hole.

fishinone

04-23-2011, 09:25 PM

I started the repair today.

I spent 3 hours trimming the crack for the weld then realized that heating the plastic with the heat gun made it an easy job.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00490-20110423-0834.jpg
That's the end of the split above the seam at the right.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00494-20110423-0835.jpg
The other end of the split is above the seam at the bow.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00495-20110423-1032.jpg
I prepared the edges for the weld. I removed all of the sawtooth breaks and most of the dirt that was in the crack and beveled the edges inside and out.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00496-20110423-1301.jpg
after prepping and cleaning the weld I tacked the 2 halves in place with a few short welds.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00497-20110423-1304.jpg
Here I'm preheating the material with a heat gun. before making a weld.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00499-20110423-1317.jpg
I put a ceramic heater inside the kayak to keep things moving a little quicker.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00502-20110423-1431.jpg
Here's the tool table. The second Harbor Freight welding tool arrived in the mail while i was working.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00504-20110423-1601.jpg
The rod holder came in the mail too.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00508-20110423-1602.jpg
This is the weld before the screen was added.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00511-20110423-1711.jpg
It looks good enough. It could be but I prefer to have it fixed for sure.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00514-20110423-1718.jpg
Adding stainless steel screen to the weld.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00517-20110423-1945.jpg
Here's the cockpit end of the weld with the screen added.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00518-20110423-1946.jpg
Here's the bow.

After taking a long time to put 10 inches of screen on I found out i can tack the screen with the heat gun by tapping it with the tip then preheat the screen and the boat with the heat gun. Just touching the screen with the iron pushes it right in.

Tomorrow I'm planning to weld the inside of the split.

If I were paying for this work by the hour it would be way better just to buy a new kayak.:Smile:

tacklejunkie

04-24-2011, 09:01 AM

It will have a hand done self accomplished feel when it's done though!
Aweomse work dude looks like you are doing it right. That thing will be stronger than new.

Did the guy say how the split happened? Looks like from a motorcycle tie down too tight around the yak or something?

fishinone

04-24-2011, 01:36 PM

He didn't say how it happened. I think it was his mom's kayak though, he said she bought another one.

I think it split because there were 2 week spots in the seam on that side. I had seen one of them before. I found another one near the bow when I was cleaning up the edges for the weld. It looked like the it had been released from the jig or clamp before the weld had solidified, then the stresses in the material pulled those areas enough to open the weld in those 2 spots.

I don't think it lasted long. The 2 spots had less than an 1/8 inch of LDPE holding them where the rest of the rest of boat had about a 1/2 inch. Regular wave action could have split it open. The scratches and dings are probably from laying around in the back yard.

I found out that it's a 2004 Endeavor model, by e-mailing Pelican the serial number.

tacklejunkie

04-24-2011, 04:40 PM

viperman100

04-24-2011, 05:43 PM

Wow! that weld looks stronger than the original seam, almost looks seamless the only thing you see is the steel mesh which only makes it that much stronger. Looks like you will be on the water in no time, keep up the good work.

fishinone

04-24-2011, 07:42 PM

Oh that's cool now you know what model you're up against.
It's a wider beam than mine too so should be even more stable.

Sounds like an early mold release or something like you say.

Looks like they were rather spendy from th get go! Nice man~
http://fishingforcreativity.com/1241440.html

Hey thanks for the link I looked for the kayak the other day but didn't find it.

Wow! that weld looks stronger than the original seam, almost looks seamless the only thing you see is the steel mesh which only makes it that much stronger. Looks like you will be on the water in no time, keep up the good work.

Thank you,

I'm thinking about doing the whole seam. I don't like that little flange around the edge. Maybe I'll do a little at a time.

fishinone

04-24-2011, 08:21 PM

I finished welding it today. Now all that's left is modification and beatification.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00521-20110424-1521.jpg
Here's the area where I started the weld inside.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/th_VID00054-20110424-1602.jpg (http://s454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/?action=view&current=VID00054-20110424-1602.mp4)
Here's a video of me making a weld.

I tried using this process with LDPE welding rod and it was like working with a noodle. Here I'm using HDPE strips that i cut from a bucket with sheet metal shears. It worked great! I wish that I had known how well it worked yesterday, it would have saved me a lot of time.

I was able to make a couple strips about 24 inches long and work through the hole that I cut in the bow to weld the split all the way to the bow. It was easier than I expected because of the stiff HDPE strip that I made from the bucket.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00524-20110424-1759.jpg
I put the rest of the screen that I have on the inside seam. I don't think that it's actually necessary but it can't hurt.

koifish

04-25-2011, 08:50 AM

nice project. love to see it when you get it done.

keepemlo

04-28-2011, 04:35 PM

Great job!man I can't wait to see your mods I think it will be totally worth it what a great post

fishinone

04-28-2011, 11:07 PM

Great job!man I can't wait to see your mods I think it will be totally worth it what a great post

Thanks keepemlo,

I'm looking forward to getting it ready and taking it fishing but right now I'm taking a break for StriperFest. I should finish it soon though.

The last thing I did was cut a bucket down for the back and weld it back up. I melted it down. It's serviceable but I have another bucket, I think I'll give it another try.

fishinone

05-03-2011, 12:07 PM

OK striper fest was a great time, we caught lots and lots of fish and spent time with a great group of people.

If you want out striperFest here are my links. Note there are lots of other reports also.

http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?55236-StriperFest-2011-Pyramid-Lake-Sat-april-30th-Sign-UP-!/page27

http://fishingnetwork.net/forum4/showthread.php?56317-StriperFest-2001-KPN-and-fishinone.

Now I'm excited to get back to "Hacking the Yak".

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00563-20110502-2156.jpg
Her's a picture of the bucket I cut down the other day sitting behind the hole it's designed to go in. I'll need to make the hole bigger.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00564-20110502-2156.jpg
That spot at the bottom is why I'm not going to weld it into the kayak. I can do better and I have another bucket.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00561-20110502-2154.jpg
I installed the back rod holders last night.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00562-20110502-2155.jpg
I mounted the front deck plate also. I'll have to pull it back off to add some sealer before I use it.

The plan is to finish it the modifications and test it this coming Saturday.

Darius

05-03-2011, 08:24 PM

You think the integrity and design has been compromised with those big holes?

fishinone

05-04-2011, 04:30 PM

You think the integrity and design has been compromised with those big holes?

I don't think so. It should be fine as long as I plug the holes so water doesn't come in.

fishinone

05-04-2011, 04:39 PM

I drilled the holes for the front rod holders. The Bolts arrive tomorrow.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00565-20110503-1905.jpg
One is a fly rod holder.

I modified another bucket too.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00566-20110503-2052.jpg
This one looks a little better.

Tonight I plan to cut the hole for the bucket then weld it if I have time.

fishinone

05-05-2011, 11:29 AM

I cut the hole in the back deck larger and welded the bucket in.

I used a jig saw for this hole. i think it's easier than the Dremmel Tool.

I fit the hole to the bucket carefully. They were nearly sealed without welding. I put a 45 degree chamfer around the hole about half way through for the weld.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00572-20110505-0726.jpg
Here's the piece that I cut out.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00570-20110504-2130.jpg
Here it is with the tackle box snapped in.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00571-20110504-2159.jpg
Here's a view of the bottom. The bottom doesn't touch the floor, I want to let the kayak flex.

Tonight I'm going to cut the seat some to make room to get my feet on the floor then reassemble everything for the test drive.

tacklejunkie

05-05-2011, 08:39 PM

Looking good man! Can use that as a bait tank too if you stick a battery bubbler in it.
I dig it.

Nice rod holder selections too.

You have me thinking I want a plastic welder!

fishinone

05-06-2011, 12:04 PM

Looking good man! Can use that as a bait tank too if you stick a battery bubbler in it.
I dig it.

Nice rod holder selections too.

You have me thinking I want a plastic welder!

Thank you tacklejunkie,

This plastic welding is addictive, I've got all kinds of ideas. So much stuff is made from it, you could use it to make or combine lots of stuff. New stuff has recycling symbols on it so you can select stuff that works together easily.

If you want some help with welding, feel free to hit me up. I'll be happy to help you.

I've got a question for you. Where does your paddle leash attach? I've got a bunch of tie down loops but I'm not sure where I should put them and I don't want to make more holes than necessary.

I can use the bucket like it is, I might just keep a bubbler in the kayak in case I make bait.

Part of the idea for the welded in bucket is to use it as a socket for other buckets. I'll set one up, maybe a 7 gallon one, as a bait tank and make a filter out of one of those bucket tackle boxes with charcoal and cotton like a fish tank. I could also stick any bucket in there for dry storage etc..

I've got it ready for tomorrows test drive. I didn't cut the seat back yet so I won't be able to stand. That could be a good thing:LOL:.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00573-20110505-2136.jpg

Then after the test drive, if all goes well.

1) I'll take it apart again.
2) Take the rest of that little lip off.
3) Put stainless steel screen all the way around the outside seam.
4) Make a bucket tackle box holder for the front, This one will be tie down instead of welded on.
5) Finish the seam and paint the top to look like stone.
The stone paint is textured, that should give me a non-skid finish.

6) Put it back together.

tacklejunkie

05-06-2011, 12:30 PM

Not using any leashes on my paddle. She floats!
Keep up the progress. She looks great all outfitted!
Careful making the 180 to grab things out of the rear, it can get a little tippy!
they say to try and keep your head in line with the center of the yak... if that helps any.

Also, to mount the yak in the water, they say to swing one leg over it like a motorcycle. Then sit your but down in it and start floating, and then fold in your legs!
Have fun! Taking mine to San Diego tomorrow, yo!

fishinone

05-06-2011, 01:27 PM

Thank you tacklejunkie,

My paddle floats too, but I thought it might be handy to be able to throw it down to grab a pole.

My impression of the kayak is that it will be stable but I'll be really careful at first anyway. I've spent a lot of time in small canoes and I swim well.:LOL:

Enjoy San Diego. I'm looking forward to the report.

fishinone

05-08-2011, 08:25 PM

I tested out the kayak yesterday.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00576-20110507-0813.jpg

It floats!I didn't have any problems, no seams or welds cracked or moved. The bucket behind me was easy to reach, I could open the top and pull out a tackle tray by reaching behind me. I was thinking about putting it closer to the cockpit. I'm glad that I didn't, my arms are long.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00577-20110507-0813.jpg
My friend Doug took this picture for me from his Hobie Pro Angler.

We had great weather for trying it out. A little later the wind came up. It's pretty easy to make way against the wind.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00578-20110507-1023.jpg
That box open on the bow is a waterproof cell phone box. That white thing is an EPP foam pad that used for a cushion.

I had another EPP foam block that I was using as a back rest. It worked well until it broke. I'm going to have to have a better back rest. I fatigued very quickly after I broke it.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00580-20110507-1028.jpg
Here's a shot of the tackle box. I crossed a couple bungee cords there, I tied mt pole down with one thinking that I might get to keep it if I was upside down.

http://i454.photobucket.com/albums/qq265/fishinone/Kayak%20Project/IMG00583-20110508-1722.jpg
I think that I'll cut this chair down and replace the seat that's in there now. I've looked at the back rests that are for sale. I believe I'd like to have a little more support. I've had my shoulder broken and I need the back support. Arm rests might help too if I can keep from having them in the way. The chair is made from the same material as the boat. They had yellow but I opted for mushroom color.:LOL: